BMW Returns
- Thread starter JayC
- Start date
Don't take this the wrong way, Jay, but if you're about to let BMW take the bike away, and bill you for the shortfall, surely a bit more flexibility may help you to sell the bike on here.
I'm sure that someone on here would be able to help you out by taking the bike, and paying more than BMW will, thus getting a good deal for them, and a better outcome for you, so why not see what you get offered?
If I were you:
(A) I'd get an advert, with nice description, pictures etc into UKGSer's FSW ASAP. Not everyone is masochistic enough to wander into the hall of treasures that is the 1200 section. You'd be sorry to miss 'em out, wouldn't you.
(B) I'd get the same advert into MCN / Autotrader / Fleabay or wherever it is bods sell bikes these days.
(C) I'd be not quite so dictatorial in your 'It's this price or nuffin' mate' approach. You are not entirely in the driving seat, not least as your only other offer seems to be £6600 and your house is apparently at risk. You'll look pretty dumb if you turn down say, £7,700 and then accept six six from BMW Finance. Standing on your principals too long, generally only makes your eyes water.
Of course if you really can afford to turn down anything less and / or you really want to / are able to keep the bike, your house, the wolf from the door and BMW Finance happy, great.... But one might then wonder what all the purpose of this thread really was.
Don't take this the wrong way, Jay, but if you're about to let BMW take the bike away, and bill you for the shortfall, surely a bit more flexibility may help you to sell the bike on here.
I'm sure that someone on here would be able to help you out by taking the bike, and paying more than BMW will, thus getting a good deal for them, and a better outcome for you, so why not see what you get offered?
Nutty, looking at the prices of the (currently unsold) bikes in the ebay link on this thread I believe that £8700 makes mine very competitive.
I am fully aware that I am not in a very good position and I accept and understand exactly what you're saying. I believe that the figure I have stated is doing someone out there a good deal. What needs to be understood here is that I have to sway this in my favour, whilst making the bike appealing to others. My financial situation dictates that I only have so much available funds to add to the selling price in order to remove the noose.
If nobody wants to follow this up then I accept that and will deal with it accordingly.
At the moment I am a stone, there is no blood to be drained, therefore no blood will be given.
I have, as stated, an existing DMP (Debt Management Plan) in place. If the bike should be returned and BMW hit me for the £2309 shortfall then I shall simply contact my advisor and the shortfall will be added to that DMP list. This means that BMW FC will have to wait for as long as it takes to be paid off. If they receive £10.00 per month then my debt will run with them for over 18yrs. It will make my life easier. That is the long and short of it.
Ultimately, this is about trying to keep the roof over my head, not about sale of the century! Similarly this is not about somebody cashing in on my misfortune.
If I lose the home anyway then bankruptcy may just be the lifeline that filters blood back into this stone.
Yes, I could invite offers, and chancers will do just that, chance their hand at deal of the century - it's not going to happen! There is no point whatsoever in me accepting an offer of, what, perhaps £7500 because I would need to find the extra blood that doesn't exist.
As I said Nutty, the home is priority, as is No1, but thanks for your efforts to help.
And there, SIRich, is the underlying reason why BMW Finance do what they do with customers who short close.
As classic a 'Risk Gap' on their books as ever there was one. BMW Finance made the OP's life easier on day one... They leant him the money to buy a motorcycle.... Now the OP wants / needs to make his life easier again with the same lender.... Unless he can sell his bike, with the finance outstanding. BMW finance are probably a bit stuck as, not least, you can only bankrupt somebody once. Add in that the courts will probably compare BMW's net asset worth compared with the OP's and find in the lesser man's favour, if the OP knows (or learns, as he seems to be doing) the game.
Of course you can always question why BMW Finance advanced the OP the money in the first place, just as much as you can ponder on why the OP took the loan out in troubled times. But that's another matter entirely.
Nutty, looking at the prices of the (currently unsold) bikes in the ebay link on this thread I believe that £8700 makes mine very competitive.
I am fully aware that I am not in a very good position and I accept and understand exactly what you're saying. I believe that the figure I have stated is doing someone out there a good deal. What needs to be understood here is that I have to sway this in my favour, whilst making the bike appealing to others. My financial situation dictates that I only have so much available funds to add to the selling price in order to remove the noose.
If nobody wants to follow this up then I accept that and will deal with it accordingly.
At the moment I am a stone, there is no blood to be drained, therefore no blood will be given.
I have, as stated, an existing DMP (Debt Management Plan) in place. If the bike should be returned and BMW hit me for the £2309 shortfall then I shall simply contact my advisor and the shortfall will be added to that DMP list. This means that BMW FC will have to wait for as long as it takes to be paid off. If they receive £10.00 per month then my debt will run with them for over 18yrs. It will make my life easier. That is the long and short of it.
Ultimately, this is about trying to keep the roof over my head, not about sale of the century! Similarly this is not about somebody cashing in on my misfortune.
If I lose the home anyway then bankruptcy may just be the lifeline that filters blood back into this stone.
Yes, I could invite offers, and chancers will do just that, chance their hand at deal of the century - it's not going to happen! There is no point whatsoever in me accepting an offer of, what, perhaps £7500 because I would need to find the extra blood that doesn't exist.
As I said Nutty, the home is priority, as is No1, but thanks for your efforts to help.
Understood, just my 2p.
Good luck with the sale, I'm sure it should go at that price. I've always sold bikes quickly on eBay, so try listing it on there as well.
No, if you were me you would do what is best for me, not you. You don't know the full picture of my circs, only your own, therefore it is is a simple case of what you would do, being you.
If you were me then you would be the author of the OP!
Mr Know-it-all strikes yet again.
Be constructive by all means, but start making assumptions and you will be responded to accordingly.
This is why you are you and I am me and why we would do different things. I know my situation, both before the finance agreement and 17 months later, whereas you guess!
Blimey , I just wish you the best of luck with it all
Good price for someone here............ for a nice 12GS and damage limitation for you Jay
Well said, Jay................ not a lot here had grasped that nugget
Whoa Neddy, it's you that is looking for help.
I only suggested methods whereby you might, if you would stop to listen for five minutes, try to maximise your spread of likely punters most able to maximise your sale price potential. The advice was no different to old Nutty's, matching his virtually word for word. But I can now see that you have declined his suggestions, too. In short, you are not selling your bike very well, advertising to the world at large that it really is a fire sale. You really do need to find a new audience and fast.
Your posts to date fluctuate between 'Woe is me, how do I get a better deal out of BMW Finance', to open defiance of anyone who will not fit into your way of seeing things, up to and including letting the finance company whistle for their subs for 18 years if you can't sell your bike quickly enough.
Though I have no idea who or what you are, I am genuinely sorry that you are in the situation you are in. I can now only suggest you follow your DMP's advice.
I only suggested methods whereby you might, if you would stop to listen for five minutes, try to maximise your spread of likely punters most able to maximise your sale price potential. The advice was no different to old Nutty's, matching his virtually word for word. But I can now see that you have declined his suggestions, too. In short, you are not selling your bike very well, advertising to the world at large that it really is a fire sale. You really do need to find a new audience and fast.
Your posts to date fluctuate between 'Woe is me, how do I get a better deal out of BMW Finance', to open defiance of anyone who will not fit into your way of seeing things, up to and including letting the finance company whistle for their subs for 18 years if you can't sell your bike quickly enough.
Though I have no idea who or what you are, I am genuinely sorry that you are in the situation you are in. I can now only suggest you follow your DMP's advice.
I have done plenty of stopping and listening thanks! I have taken on board all comments and taken the time to thank those of you who have commented on this.
Can you not see your self jumping to conclusions? Again you assume that I decline advice! Is this because I haven't met your personal timescale for listing my bike in the FS section? If so, what time should I have done it please?
Let's try an undo this 'turning things on their head' thing that you seem to be such a dab hand at: My posts may well fluctuate, as may my mood in troubled times. There are few people I have ever come across that don't portray a changing personality trait when under stress.
"Woe is me" is your take on my explanation of my predicament to explain why the bike has to go. Whereas I see it as providing a brief insight as to why things are what they are. Hang on, just reaching for the tissues!
I haven't asked for a better deal from BMW, you have 'chosen' to read something you can't actually see!
It isn't defiance I offer, it is common sense, you know, that shortage thing , that dictates to me that though I may get a better deal than £6600 on here it doesn't clear the deal with BMW FS because I cannot make up the shortfall of any figure below that of which I am prepared to sell for. Therefore there is no sale because nobody wants to buy a bike knowing there is outstanding finance on it, even if it's £100.00! If they did then they would happily up their price to own it outright whilst being in the knowledge they still got a good deal.
That I am in the shit should have no bearing on what this bike can be bought for. Instead it should be viewed that you can't buy this bike anywhere else at this price and at this mileage with this warranty on it, or unlikely, at least!
Understand, perhaps, that in the real world all people are different. Whilst I fear very little in this world I would be a liar if said this whole situation is having no effect on me. I have a constant gut churning, day in and day out over the current situation. Not about a BMW motorcycle but about how the future is going to pan out. Not about splitting with my partner of seven years, but about having to change my job, going into the unknown new job in order to work longer hours for higher pay in order to 'earn' the right to keep my home that will be my sole responsibility once the dual mortgage holders become one....and trying to find another £700.00 per month to keep the one bedroomed castle bungalow. This is where bankruptcy kicks in, not because of a motorcycle and vet bills for the cats.
Oh, and the home is barely at break even after years of negative equity. It's a whole new subject that can be tackled another day, perhaps, on the stupidity of why people mortgage themselves at 100%! Not because they know that bankruptcy is the future plan B, but because it feels right at the time.
If I really knew what fate would hold for me in several years time then I assure you, that winning lottery ticket would have been mine a long long time ago!
Once upon a not too long ago it was all affordable, I was debt free, apart from the mortgage of course. The DMP started after the BMW purchase and after my partner was made redundant when the Tories made cutbacks. NO , I am not blaming the Tories, I am explaining what happens when one thing bangs into another thing, and then makes contact with the next nearest thing, etc etc...
I/we felt safe, or as safe as you could feel in the modern employment world. My partner had never before been unemployed. It wasn't thought of, expected or welcome when it happened, but it did.
Each and every one of us are a finger click away from being in the shit in some way or another, whether you are fully loaded or on the bread line, and we all have to deal with it in our own way. Advice is always good but let it be the recipient who chooses whether that advice could/would work for them or not.
Woe be me...but that you express being sorry is appreciated.
david a hall
Registered user
The whole thread has been very enlightening.
Yes it has, and probably for differing reasons to different people.
On a personal level I have learnt much in this thread from both JB and Wapping, for positive reasons, despite recent exchanges.
I happily bought a bike , private sale , with outstanding finance some years ago. The vendor was upfront that there was outstanding finance on the vehicle and who it was with, he got a settlement figure in writing , I verbally confirmed that with the finance company and paid them what he owed & the difference to the vendor . Job done easy peasy (as JB suggested) . I also requested & received written confirmation that the bike was 'cleared' and mine.
The vendor had not mentioned any of this in his Autotrader ad' at all, but he had priced the bike keenly and consequently I was keen to buy when I viewed it which was when he fully explained the situation.
Good luck with the sale Jay
The vendor had not mentioned any of this in his Autotrader ad' at all, but he had priced the bike keenly and consequently I was keen to buy when I viewed it which was when he fully explained the situation.
Good luck with the sale Jay
Hi I suspect my friend would be looking for an 'attractive' price to consider changing bike this time of year. I read the orginal posts to mean that you wanted to move the bike on asap and therefore would meet somewhere in the middle. I suspect the bike is worth your asking to the right buyer who probably won't be looking for a new bike until the spring tbh.
Best of luck I hope things work out.
You'll get through and out the other side.
Got some more info, Jay which may be pertinent
If you hand the bike back ...
BMW FS will
Carry out an inspection, which they will charge for
Collect the bike, which they will charge for
Any remedial work, to put it into BMW AUB status (tyres/service/pads/damageor missing parts from the standard original invoice spec) they will charge for
This will be added to the settlement figure, already quoted
If you hand the bike back ...
BMW FS will
Carry out an inspection, which they will charge for
Collect the bike, which they will charge for
Any remedial work, to put it into BMW AUB status (tyres/service/pads/damageor missing parts from the standard original invoice spec) they will charge for
This will be added to the settlement figure, already quoted
Thank for the info JB. From what you write it suggests they don't recognise wear and tear but instead think buyers keep the vehicle locked (untouched) in their shed/garage/garden for the duration, up to and including the no comeback handback date.
I received a PDF file from BMW FS yesterday, which spills over into car returns also, a standard form, which put me in the picture.
Voluntary Termination Information
Excess Mileage (Select Agreements only):
Your maximum total mileage is stated on your agreement. This will be prorated to the date
we receive and accept your request to voluntary terminate. An invoice will be sent for any
mileage charge due.
Personalised plate:
If you have a personalised plate and wish to keep it, before you terminate the agreement
please call the DVLA on 0300 790 6802 to obtain a retention certificate and a new V5C (log
book). Please note it can take the DVLA up to 8 weeks to send you these. If you wish to
proceed without transferring the cherished plates, you can do so and the cherished plates
will be sold with the vehicle. You must also fit new plates at your own cost.
Vehicle condition:
If the vehicle is damaged, you should ensure it is repaired to a satisfactory standard before
returning it to us. If there is unrepaired damage when the vehicle is returned, you will be
invoiced for the anticipated reduction in its value. If the vehicle cannot be legally driven on
the road, it will be taken away by transporter and you will be invoiced for this cost.
You will be charged for any damage that falls outside the British Vehicle Rental and Leasing
Association’s Fair Wear and Tear guidelines, details of which can be found on our website at
www.bmwfs.co.uk/bmwuk/finance/existing_customers.
V5C (Log Book):
Please complete, sign and retain the yellow section 9 of your V5C as you will need to send it
to the DVLA on the day we collect the vehicle. You will need to send the rest of the V5C to
us, along with the completed Voluntary Termination Notice. If you cannot find your V5C,
please contact the DVLA immediately on 0300 790 6802 and they will send you a duplicate.
Failure to complete section 9 and forward it to the DVLA may result in you receiving a “failure
to relicense” fine. The following information is required to complete section 9:
Name & Address of motor trader – BMW Financial Services, Europa House, Bartley Way,
Hook, Hampshire RG27 9UF. The VAT number section should be left blank.
The Date of Sale or Transfer box should be completed with the date the vehicle is collected,
you must sign as the registered keeper in the Declarations box, the motor trader signature
should be left blank.
Vehicle collection:
Our appointed logistics company will collect and inspect the vehicle. You will need to be
present at the vehicle inspection, as you will need to sign to agree its return condition to
avoid any future disputes. No-one can do this on your behalf. The vehicle should be taxed,
insured and have a valid MOT up to the point that we collect it.
Please ensure the car has a minimum of quarter of a tank of fuel, is clean and accessible
(with 2 metres access on all sides), is road legal, and is returned with the spare keys, CD
cartridge, alloy keys, spare wheel, all documentation and the service history, and any other
items supplied with the car. Otherwise you will be invoiced for these items.
A fixed charge of £350.00 will be applied for any incomplete or overdue servicing. If your
vehicle has been serviced but the service light not reset, please send us all supporting
documentation that verifies your servicing is up to date. Please send this with the attached
voluntary termination request notice. For M powered vehicles such as M3, M5, M6, the
charge is significantly higher. For further details, please contact us.
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I pinged a mail back to them last night requesting to open the direct debit up again:-
1) Because I don't want to fall into arrears. I kneejerked the cancellation early as it was due this week, without allowing enough time to advertise it first.
2) As the chances are very high that I will lose the home anyway then I may just put the house on the market, pay less rent elsewhere and keep the bike.
I'm all over the place at the moment with this, and as stated earlier, this is about doing what is best for me.
I would also speak to your bank about rejecting the cancellation DD & making sure they also keep it 'live' too
This is because communications can be 'muddied'
I found out yesterday, that return conditions are quite onerous for VT as you have posted above (others should take note too)
If a bike is being p/ex'd to a new one then then dealer sorts it as part of the bike purchase & discharges BMW FS interest, however with VT they having nothing to do with the process as your contract is with BMW FS & not the supplying dealer
Some salient points in this thread for others who are using BMW Select & maybe are being faced with VT because of a change in circumstances or financial hardship
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