Route to the black forest from amsterdam - blast down or alternative?

gog

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Myself and a mate are going down to switzerland via the black forest on 8th June. Ferry from newcastle to amsterdam, arrives early on the 9th. We planned to spend the first night camping around Baden Baden and make a day of the BF before entering switzerland, but even having looked at some of the ride reports im not sure whether its best to just blast down to Baden Baden via quickest route on the nav or if theres some wee gems that we can enjoy instead, and arrive a bit later. Baden Baden isnt really set in stone either so interested to hear alternatives.

Cheers.
 
It depends on how long you have available between leaving the ferry terminal in Holland and your arrival in Baden Baden, ahead of trundling around the Black Forest the next day and then moving on to Switzerland for (I guess) your main holiday? Your opening post suggests a blast; that's fine. You could though take two days, three, four, a week or even a month, if you felt like it.

There are a load of good roads and things to see between the ferry and the top of the Black Forrest / Baden Baden / B500. There are arguably better (and worse) places to stay than Baden Baden, too. For example, you have the whole of the Ardennes, with all it's Battle of the Bulge / Band of Brotters stuff... and great roads. You also have Verdun, with all its WW1 stuff.... and great roads. There are bods on this site that will swear that the B500 is crap, whilst others will tell you it's shut to bikermates. Neither are entirely right.

I suggest you and your mate sit down together to work out what you want to do most. There are enough sticky threads with routes created to last two lifetimes, including some dedicated to just the very areas you are looking at. Look also at the RiDE website, who's route suggestions are specifically designed to answer just such a conundrum of what's 'best' to do. Failing that, contact Micky who has probably done the jaunt from Holland to and into the Black Forrest more often than most. He'll have some good ideas, for sure.

One last thought... Bods often get fixated on what they could / should do on the way TO their destination, all but ignoring that they will be coming back, presumably. Does the blast down idea work and then come back via a different route, taking in some of the things that you MIGHT have seen on the way down, if you hadn't blasted? In short, it's your holiday, what do YOU want to do really?
 
thanks for the reply wapping. yes, the Swiss alpine passes are the main destination but to be honest there is no set itinerary. I know that we would have a ball if we never even made it in to Switzerland at all.

I know its herecy but the war memorabilia holds no real allure for this trip. I have seen some of it before, and know all about it. This trip is about biking roads, beers after and having a laugh.

If it takes two days to get to the black forest it doesnt matter. Happy to bimble about if there are places worth seeing, and as suggested we are coming back the same general direction so could divert then depending on whether we have made good time, if passes are shut, etc.

Apologies for the vague and often asked 'best way' post, i know there is much info already and everyones view of whats best is different, just wanted some pointers for hidden gems as a hundred different bookmarks and possibilities means were likely just to set the sat nav and have at it. I suppose it would be difficult to have a shit time at any rate ;)
 
Mosul valley is great, don't have to look to hard for great roads around Cochem. Follow the Rhine south if you like castles, there's no shortage. I was going to do Switzerland last year but only had a week and Mrs.tree came along for her first ever biking holiday so we cut it short and stayed around the area, had a great time.
 
I know that we would have a ball if we never even made it in to Switzerland at all.

You really want to make it to Switzerland.

I cannot help you much with roads North of Baden, but if you pickup the B500 just south of Baden you will be riding the bit most people mean when they talk about the B500, it starts of quite tight and then opens out - a really good ride for about 25 miles, partly ruined by the speed limit being lowered in many places due to idiots crashing a lot, each time I go there it seems the amount of national limit stretches have been further reduced - but try and do it 1st thing before everyone else turns up.

You can follow the B500 all the way to Switzerland, it sort of disappears at times, for example the end of that good famous section, IIRC you take the B28 for a while and then get back on the 500 a bit later, but just follow the road south past Triberg and then on towards Zurich, it is worth coughing up for a Vignette and using a bit of motorway to get past the clutter around Zurich - I assume you are heading towards Andermatt - it is what most people mean when they mention the Swiss Alps.

Once there you have lots of great roads and passes - just be aware of the huge fines for speeding, the roads are that tight you do not need to go particularly fast to have fun and I have never had a problem or seen a Swiss speed trap in the 3-4 times I have ridden in the Swiss Alps, but still tend to be a bit more careful than I might in other European countries.
 
thanks chaps. paul, cochem looks like a good 'via' spot and the road down the moselle looks nice. i think ill stick that in the route and still aim for baden baden, even if its a late evening arrival.

rasher the B500 was definitely the plan, and we will make it to Switzerland. yeah heading for andermatt or thereabouts, depending on where we find to camp. i know some say the B500 is overrated but we both want to do it - this wont be the last trip so dont need to do everything at once ;)

i dont think speeding will be too much of an issue, neither of us are in any particular hurry!
 
Done this run a number of times and whilst it's a long day you get straight into your trip.

First crash some distance on the motorway down past Antwerp and then over towards Liege. Then the fun starts taking the E42 into the Ardennes and gives you the possibility of calling into the Spa racing circuit.

Next exit the E42 and come into Luxembourg looking to drop onto the Mosel river (the border between Luxembourg and Germany). Vianden is a good stop for lunch.

From here take the motorway around Trier and head south. You can continue to Baden Baden on mway all the way from here if time is against you or alternatively drop into the north Vosges, Wissembourg being a nice afternoon stop.
 
It's a long day to get down to Baden-Baden in one hit. It's not a particularly nice place either. I'd recommend Heidelburg as an alternative as it's far prettier :thumby:

I rode to Heidelburg in one day from Amsterdam with a group of friends in 2004 and hammered down the motorway to Koblenz before meandering down the east bank of the Rhine before a quick blast on the motorway to Heidelburg. The Rhine Gorge is nice, but it wasn't the best days riding due to all the motorways. These are unavoidable when leaving the Dutch ports, but I try to avoid them otherwise.

In 2015 I went back to my usual itinerary and spent the first night in Cochem via the WW2 Museum in Overloon, Aachen and B258 to the Nurburgring. The second day was a cross country route south through Hahnsruck area south of the Mosel to the technical museum in Speyer before stopping overnight in Baden Baden. In retrospect I'd have stopped slightly further south somewhere in the Black Forest.

Another alternative is to ride through northern Germany to just east of Dortmund and then head into the Sauerland (of Dambusters fame) as it's a very pretty area and often overlooked by British riders. I used to work in Germany and this was my weekend playground on my Thundercat 600 in 1999. The Sorpesee is a nice place to spend an evening. From there you can head south towards the Black Forrest or alternatively Wurzburg and the Romantic Road (head into Switzerland via Austria/Northern Italy)
 
So, there you have it OP, there are several ways to skin cat.

What would I do now? I think I'd ask Google maps for their route A to B (port to Baden Baden) which would give me the distance and direction. I would then ask it for A to C via B (port to Baden Baden to destination in Switzerland).

I'd then sit down with my mate to work out whether I / we wanted to go to Switzerland at all, not least as you don't seem to be particularly sold on the idea and / or might be happy - if you found something fun on the way - to not end up going or reduce your time in the land of Toblerone.

Then I'd look at Google map's blue line A to B or A to C via B, to see what lay either side of it that would, whilst keeping the same general direction, offer some good fun. I'd then consider that, if I mucked about in say the Ardennes for a full day or two (ie getting no closer to Switzerland, which was the original purpose of my holiday) I could also make most of the time up by hitting a motorway or getting up earlier, cracking on and not stopping to press wild flowers.

I'd also probably think to myself, I was going to go, A to B (port to Baden Baden) in one hit, so I chose Baden Baden as the furthest point I could imagine in order to hit the Black Forest the next day. I'd now realise that if I instead went port, to Ardennes and had a full day and two nights there, I could go deeper into the Black Forest the next day, taking myself right into the middle. From that central spot, I couid then have the next day hooning in the region in just about any direction I liked. If I liked it so much I could stay and / or make up the lost day on a motorway and still make it to the far side of Switzerland (if necessary) or give up on Switzerland completely. If I did that, I'd consider going into the Vosges and then up into the Morvan before going back to the port by any route that best suited my definite need to get on a ferry that would not wait for me.

What I wanted to see, I'd decide, as only I knew really. What I'd think would be fun to do, I'd decide too, for exactly the same reason. If I really did not want to touch a motorway, I'd ignore any advice or option that told me to. In short, I'd wing it or plan it or both... but, whatever, I'd do it my way.
 
Well thats certainly given me enough to go on and more. Thanks to you all. More than enough to be able to put together a route now. We are definitely going to Switzerland as I sold the idea to my mate with this as the destination. The route down was really to hit some nice places and get a brief feel for some of the areas which can be revisited another year, and then properly appreciated with more time available.

Baden baden has been ousted in favour of Heidelberg as the first night's destination.

Wapping I applaud your ability to put up with these questions again and again without becoming jaded and sarcastic ;) Ill be using a garmin and basecamp and your other threads on route creation will be invaluable.

Cheers all :thumb2
 
I've an album on Flickr from my 2015 tour which may be of interest. We went down to Brienz in Switzerland via the Mosel and Black Forest, then into the Italian Lakes before heading home via the Romantic Road, Sauerland and the Assen MotoGP :beerjug:

https://flic.kr/s/aHskgwDaNT
 
My advice= Amsterdam to Aachen fast motorway then cruise through Eifel past Nürburgring to Trier and then towards Saarbrücken-Pirmasens Pfälzer Wald/Forest and cross into France at Dahn/Fischbach into the Vosges Sarrebourg-St.Die de Vosges and down the Elsass Grand Ballon- and cross at Colmar into Germany towards Freiburg and then through Black Forest down to Switzerland….georgous
just done 3000 km Champagne, Elass, Black Forest prior to Easter, fab warm weather, great roads
 


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