Planning 50th Birthday Euro Tour Sept 2019.

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Currently in the process of planning a long Euro Tour in September 2019, to celebrate turning 50 years of age.

I know the date is someway off, but thought I'd start with a rough plan and then fine tune it as time progresses, with recommendations or from reading others tour plans on here

I have about 23 days to play with including getting from Blighty to the continent and back again.

I initially came up with a provisional route, utilising most of the Ride routes and came up with this as my plan

Day 1: Home address to Folkestone (overnight stay)
Day 2: Folkestone to overnight stop in France midway.
Day 3: Midway to Grenoble.
Day 4: Grenoble to Castellane via Col du Machine/Col du Lavent
Day 5: Castellane to Briancon
Day 6: Briancon loop around part of the RDGA
Day 7: Briancon to La Thuile via Col du Mont Cenis, Col d'Iseran, Col du petit Bernard.
Day 8/9/10: La Thuile to Riva Del Garda utilising Lakes and Mountains route from Ride Magazine via Menaggio, Bormio and Stelvio Pass.
Day 11/12: 2 day stop over in Riva Del Garda celebrating turning 50 with the domestic director who will meet me out there.
Day 13/14/15: 3 days around eastern Dolomites utilising Ride Magazine route, and ending in Bolzano via Managio and Cortina d'Ampezzo
Day 16: Bolzano to Grossglockner (stopping half way along Grossglockner)
Day 17/18/19/20/21 Grossglocker to Burwash, via Garmirsch Partinken, Baden Baden (It the last five days of the Grossglockner tour from ride magazine). I'm ending up in Burwash to visit best friend and kids with overnight stay.
Day 22: Burwash to home address.


Since coming up with that original plan, I have made some amendments. It seems a waste to travelling all that way and not do some of the other alpine passes, so I have come up with a plan B so to speak. Amended route as follows:

Day 1: Home address to Folkestone (overnight stay)
Day 2: Folkestone to overnight stop in France midway.
Day 3: Midway to Grenoble.
Day 4: Grenoble to Castellane via Col du Machine/Col du Lavent.
Day 5: Castellane to Briancon
Day 6: Briancon loop around part of the RDGA
Day 7: Briancon to Martigny via Col du Mont Cenis, Col d'Iseran, Col du petit Bernard. Col du Grand Bernard
Day 8: Martigny to Andermatt, incorporating the figure of 8 pass route from Ride Magazine around Furka, Grimsel, Gotthard, Nufen pass
Day 9: Andermatt to Bormio via Julier and Umbrail passes
Day 10: Bormio to Riva Del Garda via Stelvio Pass
Day 11/12: 2 day stop over in Riva Del Garda celebrating turning 50 with the domestic director who will meet me out there.
Day 13/14/15: 3 days around eastern Dolomites utilising Ride Magazine route, and ending in Bolzano, passing through Managio & Cortina d'Ampezzo.
Day 16: Bolzano to Grossglockner (stopping half way along Grossglockner)
Day 17/18/19/20/21 Grossglocker to Burwash, via Garmirsch Partinken, Baden Baden (It the last five days of the Grossglockner tour from ride magazine). I'm ending up in Burwash to visit best friend and kids with overnight stay.
Day 22: Burwash to home address.

With this plan B, I am thinking of cutting down the 3 days around eastern Dolomites, as I wish to somehow incorporate riding Timmelsjoch instead, either before Grossglockner or after, but haven't quite figured out a route to do this.

The other part of the plan is I am not entirely happy with is taking 5 days to get to Briancon. At much as its highly rated, I am thinking of cutting out the Col du Machine/Col du Lavant, Castellane part of the trip and heading direct to Briancon from Calais, i.e. take two days instead of 5. I have stayed in Castellane so have done the Verdon Gorge fairly recently. This will cut the trip down by 3 days.

I'm not at the stage of looking at places to stay yet, apart from it will be hotels and not camping, mainly because most of the hotels are not booking that far in advance and this tour will no doubt be amended/fine turned/scrapped many times.

So my main reason for posting on here is to seek any suggestions around incorporating Timmelsjoch into the route and is the Col du Machine/Col du Lavant as good as it is portrayed and therefore is a must do and so stays in the plan.

Really interested to hear thoughts and opinions. Am also open to any suggestions on routes I have yet to consider/missed.

Thanks for reading if you got this far
 
The Ride Routes are a fair start, but have to cater for all from Superbikes through to Goldwings and Harleys and I think they sometimes miss out some of the best stuff.

Start of with the book "Motorcycle Journey's through the Alps and Beyond" for some ideas, lots of great routes in there covering over 300 passes.

On your way out I would recommend Troyes as a great overnight stop - beautiful town with a lot of original 14th century buildings, stayed at Hotel Comtes des Champagne several times and found it good value with secure parking and right in the historic old town, otherwise loads of other nice little French Hotels in surrounding villages. You could also drop into Reims GP circuit on the way - this is a totally motorway run for us as we are 2.5 hours from Folkestone, but if you are starting closer to the tunnel you could come off the motorway after clearing the Calais clutter.

Day 2-3 you could drop down through the Morvan national park and then through the Le Puy area, avoid Grenoble and stop in the Vercors - I would suggest Hotel le Marronnier, although there are loads of options in that area, this leaves you ready for your day 4 run down to Castellane which is a nice route. Or as you hinted, leave the Vercors for another time and run down to Castellane instead, you could also take in Vallon Pont d'Arc - this is my route this year (Past Troyes / Middle of Nowhere / Castellane)

If your down at Castellane you may as well ride around the Gorge du Verdon before heading up to the Alps - my choice for a couple of nights would be around Barcelonnette which gives lots of great circular routes to ride out from taking in a selection of (my top tips) Col de la Bonnette, Allos, Cayole, Larche, Sampeyre, Valberg, Couillole, Gorge du Dulais and a few more along the way.

I would also suggest a few nights at some spots like this, otherwise you only get one shot at your "big day out", 2 spare days at Barcelonnette would give you a second chance if the weather on one day was a bit naff - and if not you can have two days out, you could make 3-4 full days riding out of here without much repetition of passes - plus you would not get bored of doing the same route day after day if you could.

On day 7 add in Col San Carlo (it is between the Petite and Grand St Bernard and bypasses some more boring bits)

Day 8 - I think getting from Martigny to Andermatt and riding the figure 9 is a bit ambitious, I would take a scenic route North out of Martigny looping around a few passes (Aigle - Saanen - Interlaken) and then run over the Grimsel and Furka into Andermatt - then spend a full day to loop around Dt Gothard, Nufenen, Grimsel, Susten to tick the rest off the list.

The Stelvio sucks in many ways, but up the Umbrail and back down the Western ramp is good, but whilst around here try and work in the Gavia pass as it is much nicer (one of our favourites) I would possibly go this way rather than back over the Stelvio on the way to Riva, did I say the Stelvio sucks - you will be there the day before to get your sticker and Bratwurst so no need to ride it again.

Cannot comment on Riva del Garda - I try and avoid the Lakes as they can be busy and touristy.

Dolomites are great - see the Alps book for lots of route ideas, Manghen is a great ride IMO.

Timmelsjoch is a bit of a PITA (IMO) as it is hard to fit it into a great route, you always seem to end up with some crap before or after it, and TBH I was not that impressed when I did ride it, certainly very pretty and better than the Stelvio, but I would not work it in at the expense of other stuff - sometimes you just cannot fit everything into a trip - even one this long, I have visited the Alps about 8 times and still not got all of my "must ride" passes ticked off.
 
With such a long trip, a couple of rest days are a good idea. You also may have the luxury of packing some more mile-eating into the first and last stages, as you'll have more than enough good stuff there to make up for it. I'd look to make up ground between Calais and Briancon: you can have a great ride there, hit some passes you haven't ridden before, but still do it in three days and include Col de la Machine; if the motivation for going to Castellane is to take in La Bonette, the gorges, roads like that, you can still do it in four – though if they'll be in the loop you ride from Briancon, you're better doing that stretch in three days.

Troyes is a good suggestion for a halfway stop, but if you're taking a first-thing crossing (which the overnight in Folkestone suggests) and you're prepared to sit on the A26 for a few hours first thing, you can get further. At a minimum, Chatillon sur Seine, but you could push on to Chaumont, Avallon (in the Morvan), Langres, Dole or Lons le Saunier.

Let's assume you head for Avallon. From there you could have a mixed day of cross-country riding with a bit of motorway, riding Combe Laval and stopping overnight at the hotel on the Col de la Machine. From there you can have a fairly laid-back day, over Col de Rousset, down to Digne and up to Briancon through Clue de Barles and along the N94 or you could put more miles on by taking a bit of Route Napoleon south from Digne to Barreme to pick up the N202, turning north over Col d'Alos or through the Gorge du Daluis and over Col de la Cayolle (Google maps won't plot those at this time of year). But that would be a pretty big day.

Martigny to Andermatt with the five-passes? Piece of cake - as long as you have a Swiss vignette to gobble up the motorway to get there directly. Martigny to Andermatt's only an hour and a half direct ride. Loads of time to fit in the five passes – it's not that long a route unless you're stopping every five minutes (you can do twice in a day, once in each direction, with an early start from anywhere on that route). I'd suggest you start with Neufennen, do the Tremola as a climb, probably with lunch at the top by the lake, Furka east to west, over Grimsel, Susten and then back to Andermatt up the gorge past Devil's Bridge.

From there to Riva looks sensible. For my money, Riva's the nicest of the Italian lakes - I loathe Como but love Riva... Great place. The riding around there is spectacular, too.

Dolomites are fabulous - busy, increasing number of speed cameras in villages, but fabulous. Only question is... why stop at Bolzano? The route carries on to Vipiteno, which is a far nicer (and smaller) town. It's also more practical from there to put in the Timmelsjoch if you want, before going to Grossglockner – though as Rasher points out, you'll end up having to claw back time on an Austrian motorway when you get to the northern end - though you're in a wide, flat valley so you may as well just get to Lienz as fast as possible as the riding off the motorway is unexceptional. Doing that might also allow the time to do the detour from Solden up to the Otztal Glacier - a great ride, though it would put 60-90 minutes into the day.

However, I'd take time in the Dolomites over time on Timmelsjoch, any day of the week. Possibly the most concentrated fine riding in Europe - and once you get away from the magic circle of Sella, Gardena, Pordoi and Campolongo (all great passes, yes) the roads become much quieter. Passo Rollei, Monte Zoncolan, Sella Ciampigotto… just stunning. Plus, I promise you, the best pizzas in Italy are in Maniago...

You could probably save time on the return run, as well. The mileages are conservative on the Grossglockner tour - and the "day" after getting there is only a half day, to allow more mucking around on the toll-road. If you get up early to enjoy it when it's empty (ie, hit the road as the sun comes up, ride it twice, then stop for breakfast) you can be filling up in Zell by 10:30 and so cover more ground that day. You should easily be able to pack that five days down to four slightly (but not excessively) longer ones.

What would you do with the saved days? I think Rasher's point about having some two-night stops in key locations to allow for Alpine weather is a good one. If you pick locations where you can either have two goes at one good route, or have a spare, second route to ride if both days are good, then you're laughing. Even an extra day in Riva to ride some of the roads around there (assuming you won't be doing them with your wife when she joins you) would be a day well spent. But I'd probably consider Andermatt or anywhere in the Dolomites (probably Cortina).

Glad the routes have been useful - but this is definitely the best way to get the most from them: tailor them to how you want to ride.
 
Ah, I last went from Martigny - Andermatt in 2010 and it was a horribly slow slog, I think the Motorway of which Simon speaks was not built back then, but lots of road works were going on to build it - which slowed us further.

Google maps currently shows it as 90 miles and 2 hours 43 minutes, when we did it I am sure it took us much longer as it was all single carriageway roads with lots of built up areas (and road works)

As for the Dolomites, was there last year and as Simon states the main loop around Arabba was quite busy (set off early) and the valley roads that link them got very busy (and hot) but it is still well worth the effort - and as stated once away from the Corvara / Arraba / Cortina triangle the traffic disappears quite nicely.

I am also fairly certain that either the speed cameras do not work (have heard rumours most are empty) and / or they do not send tickets to the UK, with the sheer volume of cameras (small villages can have three in them) and the way the speed limits bounce up and down (like around the North Circular, but worse) I must have set some off whilst there....

...I can however tell you that the Grand Dickhead of Luxembourg (or whatever he calls himself) will send tickets back to the UK - even for 2 mph over the (low) national speed limit.
 
Nothing much to add to better the already excellent responses from Rasher and Simon. You're a credit to the place you guys.. :thumb
 
Thank you all very much for your excellent informative posts, which have given me plenty of food for thought.

I did consider a loop of Gorge du Verdon, however I rode this a couple of years ago, and so decided to miss it out of this trip, in order to do more of the stuff I haven't done before.

I will definitely look at cutting down the days of travel to and from as this will free up 'spare' days.

I have the 'Alpes and beyond book', which I bought several years ago, and so will also consult that.

I read about Gavia pass the other day, so will also have a look at fitting that in. What is the run down from Umbrail to Livignio like? Is it worth adding that in?

I'm aware of the Stelvio being overrated, but it is something I would like to do, just to tick it off the list. I will have a look at this again, just so that I do it only the once.

I have come to the same conclusion about Timmeljosch, in that it looks an absolute pain to fit it into a suitable route, without having to do some crap boring roads, and in light of your views on it not being a very good run, I will exclude it from this tour on this occasion. There is plenty else in the tour to keep me happy.

Once again thank you for your suggestions and responses.
 
I would certainly recommend putting some days off in your schedule.

Having a day not having to pack/unpack and able to kick back is restful.
 
Lots of good advice here already. The only significant change I’d make, if possible, would be to scrap the overnight stay in Folkestone on day one.

Why?

Besides Folkestone being a pit, which is reason enough, crossing over to France the night before saves one hour (simply due to the time difference) and probably another hour and a half or maybe two, by the time you have left your hotel, checked in, crossed the channel and ridden out the other end. Call it two hours, plus the hour time difference = 3 hours. That’s about 100 miles on D rural French roads and a lot further on the motorway.

If you can do it, I’d suggest St Omer, a very short hop down the motorway from Calais. If you are on a budget, the Ibis Budget is basic but quite alright. It has a good car large park along two 24 hour petrol stations within a quarter of a mile. It’s easy to walk into the main square (15 minutes) and above all easy to ride out of when you come to leave in the morning. Skip the breakfast and stop at a cafe (or on the motorway) after say an hour. You’d maybe be half way across the Channel if you’d stayed in Folkestone but instead you are having a coffee in France.... your holiday has really begun!

Richard

PS When you’ve finished carving out your route why not carve it into Google maps or into a .gpx route and share it here? It’ll give bods a chance to really look at it and, who knows, give them an idea or two to copy.

PPS Do the Stelvio; it’s inconic, for very good reasons. Yes, you might have to work at it going up the steep side.... but that’s the whole point, it’s not meant to be ‘easy’.

IMG_20130811_110250.jpg


They even go up it in (proper) cars:

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/_NGpDmWNqh4" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 
The only reason I would stop in Folkestone is to avoid utterly shite weather.

Typically we leave on a Saturday, by the time we get home from work on a Friday we would not really have enough time to get across and into France, but we can then load up the bikes, get an early night (in a comfy and familiar bed) and set off before 6:00am having had a good nights rest....

...but if it is looking like Saturday morning will be pouring with rain and Friday evening is looking much better I would just do a last minute Hotel booking for somewhere close to Folkestone so we will not arrive at the crossing already wet and miserable.

Agree with doing the Stelvio, but it really is a "tick off the list" ride in my mind, and certainly would suggest to do it if nearby.

It must be said the Tommelsjoch is a lovely pass but there is nothing good at the Northern end, so unless it forms a natural part of your route from A to B it is hard to create a good ride that takes it in.

I made the mistake of doing a lot of messing to fit it in to one of my trips and was "rewarded" with 35c heat all the way up the Valley to the Motorway and then all the way along the Motorway to Inbsbruck - with Hindsight I should of just ridden up and over and the top and turned around and came back and used the Jaufenpass, this would of also saved me having to pay for the toll.

The run from the TJ to the Innsbruck Motorway is in a low (hot) valley and goes through lots of built-up areas, it seems to take forever and then just drops you off on a Motorway, although if heading East you can take the Kuhtai Sattel road to Innsbruck which is certainly a lot nicer than the Motorway, much as I liked the TJ I think the time it cost me in the Dolomites was too high a price.
 
A friendly opinion from left field :hide

You've got over 3 weeks to do a very celebratory ride. The Alps can be done easily in a normal 2 week holiday - most of it can be done in a 9 day dash, that's only 1 working week.

With 23 days you could ride through the Balkans - Romania, Bulgaria, northern Greece, Albania and Montenegro are all superb. Empty roads, amazing scenery, good, cheap hotels etc....

I know that the bulk of the holiday traffic is gone from the Alps in September but that's when the German bikers descend (and there's lots of them) as well as the Italian camper vans :eek: ohhh I nearly forgot about the bicycles :blast
I just think you've got the opportunity to go further afield, to somewhere that is out of the ordinary and a lot more diverse - 1, 2, 3 passes...... well they're all the same after that ;) another alpine hotel tonight zzzzzz.

Anyway just my thoughts, to be taken with a pinch of salt - obviously :beerjug:
 
Lots of good advice here already. The only significant change I’d make, if possible, would be to scrap the overnight stay in Folkestone on day one.

Why?

Besides Folkestone being a pit, which is reason enough, crossing over to France the night before saves one hour (simply due to the time difference) and probably another hour and a half or maybe two, by the time you have left your hotel, checked in, crossed the channel and ridden out the other end. Call it two hours, plus the hour time difference = 3 hours. That’s about 100 miles on D rural French roads and a lot further on the motorway.

If you can do it, I’d suggest St Omer, a very short hop down the motorway from Calais. If you are on a budget, the Ibis Budget is basic but quite alright. It has a good car large park along two 24 hour petrol stations within a quarter of a mile. It’s easy to walk into the main square (15 minutes) and above all easy to ride out of when you come to leave in the morning. Skip the breakfast and stop at a cafe (or on the motorway) after say an hour. You’d maybe be half way across the Channel if you’d stayed in Folkestone but instead you are having a coffee in France.... your holiday has really begun!

Richard

PS When you’ve finished carving out your route why not carve it into Google maps or into a .gpx route and share it here? It’ll give bods a chance to really look at it and, who knows, give them an idea or two to copy.

PPS Do the Stelvio; it’s inconic, for very good reasons. Yes, you might have to work at it going up the steep side.... but that’s the whole point, it’s not meant to be ‘easy’.

IMG_20130811_110250.jpg


They even go up it in (proper) cars:

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/_NGpDmWNqh4" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Wapping

Thank you for your suggestion re not staying overnight in Folkestone and cracking on into France for an hour or so. Never even considered that. I will take your advice for sure.

Forgive my ignorance, as I am a bit of an IT Luddite, but how would I go about showing my route on here? Would it be best to do screenshots or just post links to gpx files? If i’m doing screenshots of basecamp can I remove the waypoints from the display?

I would do it on google maps but this time of year not every route can be plotted.
 
Me & a mate are off to Spain / Portugal / France this September to celebrate our 50th year on Earth...

I think I started my planning in 2016. Finding it hard to think of anything else during that whole time.

With just over 6 months to departure now, it's getting a bit pressurised for me to finalise some of the stuff I wanted to get together for the trip - luggage items, tech bits & pieces, etc. Looking now like I won't have everything I'd hoped to have. I'd suggest getting your want-lists defined nice & early. If you're loaded then that won't matter, but I'm not, so it does. No biggie - it just means I'll have to use what I have for this trip, and I'll have my ideal loadout together for wherever we go in 2019.

For adding a pic of your route to your posts, this is how I do it: copy / paste zoomed-in sections on my map on BaseCamp, patch them all together in MS Paint, then crop the edges of the final image and save it. Laborious, but it does the job, and I don't know a different / better way.

Starting Malaga, finishing Cherbourg.

Red routes = paved / asphalt roads, green = TET (some of which seem to include sections of paved / asphalt roads).

We'll doubtless be dipping in & out of TET on the fly, and may also tweak the road routes on the fly too, if we see something interesting, the weather's shite, or we just want a break, etc.

France in particular for now is just preliminary.

I'm really struggling to not be super-obsessed and anal about this trip, but one thing I will say is that the potential for tweaking the route on the fly is absolutely fine with me - I don't feel the need to follow my BaseCamp routes turn-for-turn; we're broadly following that basic route of west-from-Malaga, north-from-Sagres, east-across-Picos, and north-through-France. We'll be camping or B&Bing - whatever suits on the day. We might plan ahead for booking accommodation the odd night (for showering, any work that needs done on the bikes, re-sorting luggage, shite weather, etc.).

Maybe that's something to be flexible with on your trip - having it super-planned and super-rigid might feel the way to go, and might float your boat, but do be open-minded about tweaking routes or sections, both between now & trip time (as you're already aware), but also mid-trip.


BaseCamp MA50.jpg
 
but how would I go about showing my route on here?

Save the Garmin file to something like Dropbox and post the link in the thread.

That’s how I do it. It’s free, it’s easy and it works.

Lots of self help videos out there on how to use Dropbox, too.
 
Obviously my advice will be of no use to the op, ie book a ferry and first hotel a few weeks in advance and go. A rough destination sometimes like a country, that's it. 2019 is to far away for my brain.&#55357;&#57024;&#55357;&#56977;
 


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