Clutchless Shifting

buncobooth · Oct 7, 2018

Does anybody regularly use clutchless shifting (and no I don't mean with a quick shifter) on their Hexhead GS/GSA ? I found out I can do this recently, upshifts after 1->2, but there seems to be a difference of opinion as to if this is harmful to the gearbox ? They seem to get easier the higher up you go, 4->5 and 5-> 6 are so smooth and easy, not sure why I haven't done this before !

Sidney · Oct 7, 2018

Yes I do but it only feels right from 4th up. You can also do a down shift down to 4th but you need to get the timing and the revs right.

I’ve done it on any bike I’ve had and just do the shifts that are smooth. If it’s not easy and it’s clunky and the bike lurches then it’s not a good idea.

So as long as it’s a smooth shift it’ll be fine. All you are doing is replicating the quick shifter using the throttle to release the load through the gearbox (rather than cut the ignition for a split second) and clicking the next gear.

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NicD · Oct 7, 2018

Is there any advantage to clutchless shifting on this kind of bike?

er-minio · Oct 7, 2018

as to if this is harmful to the gearbox

Never had any issues with the gearbox on my 1200GSA, the previous R1100S and my older R1150R (70k miles on it).
I don't do it all the time, but I can easily shift up and down if/when I want (not in the first two gears usually).

any advantage

Not really to be fair IMHO.

Popell · Oct 7, 2018

Anything after 2nd on the way up without clutch-just cut the throttle momentarily , use the clutch going down.
Never had a problem

mikeyboy · Oct 7, 2018

I never use the clutch upshifting on any bike,
Just a matter of learning the characteristics of the bike etc,
Downshifting is another thing,some gearboxes will work quite well others it’s a Nono,
A Ktm box,no prob,650 Bmw no prob with a blip and a prod,air head,hmmmm

mikeyboy · Oct 7, 2018

NicD said:
Is there any advantage to clutchless shifting on this kind of bike?

A clutchless upshift once mastered is really smooth,
Great if you have a pillion on :thumby:

buncobooth · Oct 7, 2018

I am struggling a bit with the lower changes (2->3 and 3->4), they don't always seem to go in as easily as the higher ones. Again there seems to be some difference of opinion as to whether you should pre-load the lever before the shift or not ?

db-89 · Oct 7, 2018

i do it when hooning around or with a pillion,helps cut down on helmet knock. dont do it in 1st or 5th going up and never going down

mikeyboy · Oct 7, 2018

buncobooth said:
I am struggling a bit with the lower changes (2->3 and 3->4), they don't always seem to go in as easily as the higher ones. Again there seems to be some difference of opinion as to whether you should pre-load the lever before the shift or not ?

Shortshift in the low gears,
Load gear-lever and roll off the throttle for a split second,job done.
If you are on a mission ,think like a power shifter,unload the box with a quick throttle closure (really quick),
Then snick the next gear while unloaded.
Bike gearboxes are designed to work this way,
There’s no synchronisers,just dog gears, :thumby:

NicD · Oct 7, 2018

True re pillions

I remember seeing this a while ago and thought it interesting
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p09goXGd9Ro

Don't see the need myself, but that's just my view

UturnTony · Oct 8, 2018

It's another skill to develop which can help put you more in tune with the bike and i do sometimes
use it but, i don't make a habit of it because i'm a riding god and can manage very smooth
changes using the clutch

Bendy toy · Oct 8, 2018

I use the clutch lever (habit - always have) but it only assists the shift and never fully opens the clutch plates. Going down, I mismatch the clutch and throttle to blip the revs then it's uber smooth on downshift. I've never mastered a clutchless downshift so can't comment on it being "doable".

Tractors are go · Oct 8, 2018

I spent a day with Roddy Benzies of Get2Grips (excellent and highly recommended) where we spent sometime getting clutchless gear changes up/down correct ie no throttle blipping etc.

My complaint that the gsa is a big torquey twin cut no ice, as he used R1200RTP at Tulliallan and you don't see police motorcyclists blipping on down changed.

It certainly helps you think more about mechanical sympathy.

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Bendy toy · Oct 10, 2018

I was told this to downshift on closed throttle -

Put gentle pressure on the gear lever, then a slight tweak of throttle (momentarily unloads the driveline) and the gear drops in.

It worked nicely on the shaft drive Diversion 900, but I find the GS will crash the gear too easily so I use the mismatched clutch/thotttle to lift the revs. There's no deliberate whacking the throttle open.

I hate simply stamping the gears down as it always crashes and clunks. Ditto overly slow upshifts. I'm amazed the gearboxes can cope with the abuse of not matching the revs.

timeandtide · Oct 10, 2018

buncobooth said:
I am struggling a bit with the lower changes (2->3 and 3->4), they don't always seem to go in as easily as the higher ones. Again there seems to be some difference of opinion as to whether you should pre-load the lever before the shift or not ?

Definitely don’t preload - make sure you’re accelerating, then momentarily close throttle and simultaneously shift.
Job’s a carrot &#55358;&#56661;!

shaunandco · Oct 10, 2018

I do it most of the time on upshift and sometimes on downshift- have done on most bikes for years. Don't really do it for any particular reason other than I'm too lazy to put my left hand back on the bars!!

Pauly S · Oct 10, 2018

Ive too much mechanical sympathy to do clutchless gear changes,deffo dont want to crunch the gears,so i just use the clutch.no bother.The gs is a tractor.

Tractors are go · Oct 10, 2018

Nomad biker said:
Ive too much mechanical sympathy to do clutchless gear changes,deffo dont want to crunch the gears,so i just use the clutch.no bother.The gs is a tractor.

If you practice, there's no crunching of gears.

The hard I use the quick shifter on the rr, better it works. Hence for it shall be known as the sewing machine.

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g.s.john · Oct 10, 2018

Clutch less from 2nd up when the box has warmed up not changing down too easy to get wrong as you have to catch the backlash in the transmission just right to get a smooth change.

Clutchless Shifting

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