Choice of Air Vest technology ..

There is a plus and minus to everything, how does a back protector and neck brace protect your front then? Is there any evidence as to the number of people who have got whiplash and crashed from a bird strike. The deployment is in mili seconds, so why wouldn't it protect you from a low side or side impact, as the impact happened and the mass was moving the bag would be inflated before the movement stopped. Please show the evidence on your assumptions, or are they just assumptions.

It's partly true, in terms of a bird strike. it's also true for the tether systems that yes you will have delayed protection, because you have to be a certain distance away from the bike before the airbag has gone off. I'll give you an example.

We're on a business park here at Moto Central, and we had a couple come into us last year, male and female on their own bikes. The lady rider had only been riding for 2-3 weeks at the time, and when she pulled out of our business park, for some reason she looked left and forgot to look right, which is the direction she was going. She ended up pulling out on a truck, who to be fair slammed his breaks on and ended up hitting her at a much lower speed than expected. Her husband was sat behind her waiting to pull out also, and seen the whole thing. Now I don't know what has happened to her since, but we took the guys bike in and locked it up overnight in our cafe, and he came back to collect it the next day, whilst his wife was in a coma, there wasn't anything he could do. Now she had broken bones almost everywhere, legs, ribs, collar bone, arms everything - fortunately she was knocked out at point of impact so she probably didn't feel anything (I hope). The only thing that would have helped her, was a built in airbag system, like the Dainese/Alpinestars version. A tether wouldn't have gone off straight away, although it definitely would have been better than nothing, as she did go about 20-30 feet down the road, and the landing would have been cushioned.

My point with all this is, If you have any concern about safety, providing the monetary side of things isn't a hinderance, you should buy the best you can afford, the most reliable motorcycle kit. Sometimes comfort and ease of use isn't everything, we don't know what we need really, until it's needed.
 
It's partly true, in terms of a bird strike. it's also true for the tether systems that yes you will have delayed protection, because you have to be a certain distance away from the bike before the airbag has gone off. I'll give you an example.

We're on a business park here at Moto Central, and we had a couple come into us last year, male and female on their own bikes. The lady rider had only been riding for 2-3 weeks at the time, and when she pulled out of our business park, for some reason she looked left and forgot to look right, which is the direction she was going. She ended up pulling out on a truck, who to be fair slammed his breaks on and ended up hitting her at a much lower speed than expected. Her husband was sat behind her waiting to pull out also, and seen the whole thing. Now I don't know what has happened to her since, but we took the guys bike in and locked it up overnight in our cafe, and he came back to collect it the next day, whilst his wife was in a coma, there wasn't anything he could do. Now she had broken bones almost everywhere, legs, ribs, collar bone, arms everything - fortunately she was knocked out at point of impact so she probably didn't feel anything (I hope). The only thing that would have helped her, was a built in airbag system, like the Dainese/Alpinestars version. A tether wouldn't have gone off straight away, although it definitely would have been better than nothing, as she did go about 20-30 feet down the road, and the landing would have been cushioned.

My point with all this is, If you have any concern about safety, providing the monetary side of things isn't a hinderance, you should buy the best you can afford, the most reliable motorcycle kit. Sometimes comfort and ease of use isn't everything, we don't know what we need really, until it's needed.

I understand you sell these things and may have a view. But there is a lot of ifs and maybes in the story above. She wasn't wearing any vest or built in system, so you don't know the outcome if she had been wearing one or the other. If you actually speak to Helite (I know they have a vested interest) their vest inflates quicker than the BT (GPS) ones. Tether wise, again it all depends on how long your tether is and how you have set it, there are clear instructions on how long the tether should be. If you look at going off times between tether and BT systems, there is actually nothing in it with milliseconds and certainly nothing about distance from the bike. At least with a tether you know your bag will inflate, what happens if the BT encompasses interference and doesn't go off? I know its all been tested, but everyone is stating what ifs :) So instead of heresy, how about some actual facts. Helite have a chap who was a Triumph test rider who hit a car at 70 mph and walked away, the emergency services couldn't believe how effective the system was.

Also if your vest does go off and nothing is damaged you can replace the canister and you are good to go again, the vest actually repacks itself as I found out when I got pushed off my bike whilst at a standstill. If your integrated vest goes off, you need to send the kit back to be reset (now this may have changed but was the case last year) So in my case I had a spare canister and was good to go again in minutes.

Edited - Think inflation times are being kept close to the manufacturers chests and how they measure them, but according to the Helite site, theirs inflates in less than 75 milliseconds and the built in ones state 25 milliseconds, so are faster to inflate, but according to Helite deployment time is quicker with theirs, whatever that means :) At the end of the day, everyone makes their own choices and should buy what works for them.
 
As a Road Traffic police motorcyclist for the most of my thirty years I can think of at least three fatal road accidents and a number of serious injury accidents whereby an air vest would have, in my opinion, saved the life and/or reduced the injuries by a large margin!

Having said that, when a car turned across Sue's path on the Karakorum Highway in Northern Pakistan, and she hit the door pillar head on, an air vest would not have saved her from injury. She went down in a big heap, before my eyes, and was still on the 'bike on the ground. Injury ... a broken arm. She was lucky!

The only reason for not wearing an Air Vest would be vanity ...

:beerjug:
 
I’ve had a Point 2 for 3 years now and used it once in anger (within about 20 mins of fitting the tether!). Had the front of my old GS tuck in on a wet off camber road with a new front whilst pulling in to let a car pass. Admittedly it happened at low speed (about 15 mph) but suffice to say that it had inflated before I hit the ground which I was impressed with and they are definitely tight when they go off.

Like others have said, it might seem a bit odd to put on to start with but it’ll soon become second nature. My only advice is if you want one, buy one but make sure you get it correctly sized for you.
 
Ok so heres a couple of my actual facts, because I have deployed mine...

1) In a recent bird strike, I was hit in the face by a dozy pigeon at 60 mph. It's like a punch in the face with a boxing glove (when you least expect it)... the airbag did nothing, and I ended up with mild whiplash. A neck brace would have restricted hyperextension (neck being flung back) as it's always deployed. The airbag did nothing.

2) On a recent rideout, my front wheel jammed in a rut on an off-camber steep turn at low speed, and I toppled sideways. Bike went down fast, and so did I. But I was still hanging onto the bike and the airbag deployed while my neck was at a verticle position, while my body was sideways. I was fighting to stay upright. The airbag deployed violently and whipped my neck horizontally sideways GIVING ME whiplash!!!!.... which wouldn't have happened with a neck brace as that doesn't violently push your head sideways... It's a risk you take....

So airbags are not without risk.

I wear my airbag without fail for road riding.

I wear my neck brace, back and chest protector, and knee braces for off-road.
 
In airbag tests you're always stood upright.

Now you deploy that airbag when your body is horizontal but your head is cranked over near verticle, like a lowside or static toppleover.

It jolts your neck violently !!
 
In airbag tests you're always stood upright.

Now you deploy that airbag when your body is horizontal but your head is cranked over near verticle, like a lowside or static toppleover.

It jolts your neck violently !!

The tests I've seen the air vest locates the head and secures it from movement ...

In my 30 years of dealing with, and attending, motorcycle accidents, a broken neck has never been in the equation. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, of course it does ...

Young lad on a wet roundabout fell off ... the guy in the Ford Transit pick up truck saw what was happening and had stopped. The kid skidded and slid in to the rear wheel of the stationary pick up truck. He walked in to the ambulance, gave me his moms phone number. Told her he was going to hospital but was OK.

He died the next day of a ruptured spleen ... the Helite Air Vest would have saved him. Of that I am 100% sure

You pays your money and you takes your choice ...

:beerjug:
 
Ok so heres a couple of my actual facts, because I have deployed mine...

1) In a recent bird strike, I was hit in the face by a dozy pigeon at 60 mph. It's like a punch in the face with a boxing glove (when you least expect it)... the airbag did nothing, and I ended up with mild whiplash. A neck brace would have restricted hyperextension (neck being flung back) as it's always deployed. The airbag did nothing.

2) On a recent rideout, my front wheel jammed in a rut on an off-camber steep turn at low speed, and I toppled sideways. Bike went down fast, and so did I. But I was still hanging onto the bike and the airbag deployed while my neck was at a verticle position, while my body was sideways. I was fighting to stay upright. The airbag deployed violently and whipped my neck horizontally sideways GIVING ME whiplash!!!!.... which wouldn't have happened with a neck brace as that doesn't violently push your head sideways... It's a risk you take....

So airbags are not without risk.

I wear my airbag without fail for road riding.

I wear my neck brace, back and chest protector, and knee braces for off-road.

Thanks for sharing real experience. My experience is limited to accidental deployment getting my GS in a rush to take a photo.
 
Whilst attending the BMW off road school in Wales my partner went horse riding. She came off the horse but was wearing the point 2 vest. It inflated per spec and protected her back.

By the time she hit the deck her back was aligned and protected. A week later at hospital for a checkup they commented stage vest had helped protect her.

They is a beautiful sweeping road that twists downhill through the vineyards of Sancerre approx a mile before you enter the town. I kept off my GS to take a picture and my point 2 triggered - I couldn’t deflate it fast enough with my biker mates trying to take pictures.
 
I'll give you another example where an airbag actually might not help.

When I lowsided my Bandit 1250 a few years ago at 40mph.. I hung on to the handlebars for as long as possible (so the bike didn't flip)... but eventually I had to let go and I slid slideways down the road... I had NO INJURYS except a huge bruise on my thigh where it slammed on the road.

Now... if an airbag had deployed.... it turns you into a round barrel !!! ... and it's highly likely at 40mph to put you in a barrel roll, with arms flailing. Because you bounce and skip... rather than friction and sliding slowing you down.

It's speculation, but I don't know.... you never know how it'll pan out.

I still wear my Helite airvest though, as the odds are in your favour I think.

Accidents produce the oddest angles, the most violent sudden stops, and my greatest fear.... barbed wire fencing, and motorway steel barriers!! They'll cut you clean in two.
 
An Airvest is not going to save you in every eventuality, the same as a Helmet may cause injuries. But its a better solution than nothing. Unlike Warlord, who seems to be the most unlucky bloke when it comes to offs, my air vest did deploy when I was hit from the side and I did not suffer any whip lash and I'm obviously very lucky not to have ever been smashed on the head by a bird in 50 years of riding, although a bee hurts :)
 
I just do a lot of miles in all conditions.

I read somewhere a long time ago that statistically a motorcycle rider is due an accident something like every 3000 hours of riding. I notch up those hours quickly.

But I do wear a lot of protective kit as well.
 
I just do a lot of miles in all conditions.

I read somewhere a long time ago that statistically a motorcycle rider is due an accident something like every 3000 hours of riding. I notch up those hours quickly.

But I do wear a lot of protective kit as well.

Good effort, I do a lot of miles all year around as well, I'm a blood biker and normally cover on average 10k a year on my own bike as well :) Don't do any off road stuff though.
 
I think the general consensus, is that you should wear an airbag vest - the right type you ultimately have to make a decision on. One thing to bear in mind, they're all trying to "sell" you that each of their systems is the best. Take advice from real world users, and people who know a reasonable amount about each system and how they work. My personal opinion is the Dainese system is the best one, my colleagues prefer how the Alpinestars system works. The real "game changer" in the way of Airbags will be the Ixon vest when it's fully in market, but I don't know a lot about the full specs on this yet, they haven't got much in English to view yet. I've seen the technical Data of Dainese a lot - in fact, we've just sent a D-Air 1 piece suit back to them for a check up which has been in use 4 years now and around 500 miles or more per day as a test rider for Triumph. It might not compute to anyone on here, but with Dainese you can track your data on track, how fast etc, because it uses GPS - so some might prefer them for that purpose. The alpinestars airbag has 2 deployments, not just one which people might prefer. For road use, some people are put off by tether systems, understandably why, but please anybody thinking about it just go for something. You never know when it's going to be needed, the type of accident you have will be different every time. I've genuinly in the past had people tell me "they only low side" so it doesn't matter.... which I'm sorry that's the dumbest thing said to me ever... you can easily get hit - you're not god... not unless someone has somethign to tell me at least??

Read it about Airbag technology, compare a few, buy one in your affordability range =)
 
I agree with Motocentral....

But if you are put off by the cost, buy it secondhand like I did.... Helite Turtle brand new unit (second hand unused) cost me £200 off eBay. Job done.
 
Talking to my daughter’s man who commutes daily to work on his Gsa, we were discussing the dangers of that daily run regarding careless driving by cars etc, he seems to take it in his stride ( I was young and foolish once) I mentioned that as far as I can remember my early accidents had been my fault but since retiring the near offs etc have been down to others not me. I find at my age 73 riding defensively for most of the time is very tiring but very necessary. But as I’ve become a carer for my Linda I’m seriously thinking should I really be riding and older bodies don’t like being chucked down the road no matter what speed.
 
Talking to my daughter’s man who commutes daily to work on his Gsa, we were discussing the dangers of that daily run regarding careless driving by cars etc, he seems to take it in his stride ( I was young and foolish once) I mentioned that as far as I can remember my early accidents had been my fault but since retiring the near offs etc have been down to others not me. I find at my age 73 riding defensively for most of the time is very tiring but very necessary. But as I’ve become a carer for my Linda I’m seriously thinking should I really be riding and older bodies don’t like being chucked down the road no matter what speed.

Bit off topic, but IMHO if your starting to feel like that, give up, if I ever start to have doubts I will. I'm a mere youngster at 61 though
 
Bit off topic, but IMHO if your starting to feel like that, give up, if I ever start to have doubts I will. I'm a mere youngster at 61 though

+1

I'm only 51

But once I feel the environment is too dangerous, or I'm risking my families happiness with it all.

I'll hang up my boots.
 
The thing is guys my bikes since 1962 have been a major part of my life, so it’s going to be a hard sell giving it/ them up although my girl says keep on biking.
Tough call folks and I hope yours in late in coming.
 
The thing is guys my bikes since 1962 have been a major part of my life, so it’s going to be a hard sell giving it/ them up although my girl says keep on biking.
Tough call folks and I hope yours in late in coming.

Very tough decision - good luck :)
 


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