My device keeps sending me back...

beaver

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I have created you a new thread to save this question being muddled into your thread on strange track views. Richard

.... One thing I need to understand is missing a point you've put in.. how do you move the thing on?.. I was playing a few weeks ago and set 5 point into the Nav. off we went but I must of missed one slightly in Beverley, and all it did thereafter was try and turn me around to go back to the thing. Maybe I should of stopped and played with it until I worked it out, but as I knew where I was going from this point, I just carried on...
 
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What software did you use to create your route, if it wasn’t BaseCamp or Mapsource?

Learn the difference between:

A. A waypoint, basically a point that you have told the dumb device you must go through, and....

B. A shaping point, a point you have used when creating your route, in order to force the magenta line (and therefore the route and the dumb device) along a specific road

There are lots of threads on the topic.

Learn also:

A. How to change a waypoint into a shaping point from within BaseCamp / Mapsource and visa-versa, and....

B. How to change them from within the device itself

Again, lots of posts and threads on the topic.

Learn also, the skip waypoint function. Threads on the subject, too.




PS. If I had to start somewhere, I’d start by learning the difference between the two.
 
Whilst, in my view at least, he gets a bit carried away with his shaping points, this is not a based guide as to how to use BaseCamp to...

1. First of all you start with a simple basic route between A and B, start to end. By default A and B are always waypoints, unchangeable. I always start by creating my routes this way.

2. How to create shaping points, to ‘shape’ (literally pull, like an elastic band) the route to follow the roads you want the route to take

Depending on whether you use a Mac or a PC it differs a little bit but, in essence, he explains it reasonably well. For example a Mac, by default, always creates shaping points as waypoints, sp you have to change them back into shaping points separately

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/OnBQDIJn1GI" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>


Whilst again it differs between a Mac and a PC, this is a good enough very basic guide on how to change a shaping point into a waypoint and why you might do it...

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/MabPdG9IQFY" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

PS Learn, whilst you are at it, what effect routing preferences have on route creation and the importance of having the preferences set on your device to match those on your home computer. As a rule, I turn all the routing preferences off. Why? it saves me having to remember that I have turned some or all of them on. See several threads where bods moan that the dumb device keeps on taking them off the motorway, when plainly it’s the quickest way from A to B. The reason? Very probably they set their device’s preferences to ‘Avoid motorways, take windy roads’..... and the device does its very best to follow its master’s instructions, much to the master’s frustrations.
 
cheers.,. will take a look.. I did more of mine on the Nav 5 itself... did try it on base camp but for some reason, the planned route came off the motorway for a junction, and try as I might, I could not get it to go back on?

will watch the above.. many thanks

watched them
well that explains a lot... I've not done enough points for sure, and the point about the other side of the motorway I full understand as it was taking me back from where I'd just come.. obviouse I guess, but I did think it may have a bit more about it to know you didn't want to do that?... Also, by the time you spent doing all of this, you could of riden it? again, Id assumed it would be a bit easier, but obviously not... :) right, off to play
 
I have created you a new thread to save this question being muddled into your thread on strange track views. Richard

.... One thing I need to understand is missing a point you've put in.. how do you move the thing on?.. I was playing a few weeks ago and set 5 point into the Nav. off we went but I must of missed one slightly in Beverley, and all it did thereafter was try and turn me around to go back to the thing. Maybe I should of stopped and played with it until I worked it out, but as I knew where I was going from this point, I just carried on...

When out riding using the nav ,there’s a skip button in the menu, quite easy to find, when approaching a waypoint that you have just inserted and you want to by pass it, push the skip button, this will take you to the next waypoint

So if you just miss one as you did, and it wants to return to it, skip it , then you are back on route .
 
cheers.,. will take a look.. I did more of mine on the Nav 5 itself... did try it on base camp but for some reason, the planned route came off the motorway for a junction, and try as I might, I could not get it to go back on?

will watch the above.. many thanks

watched them
well that explains a lot... I've not done enough points for sure, and the point about the other side of the motorway I full understand as it was taking me back from where I'd just come.. obviouse I guess, but I did think it may have a bit more about it to know you didn't want to do that?... Also, by the time you spent doing all of this, you could of riden it? again, Id assumed it would be a bit easier, but obviously not... :) right, off to play

You should find it easier to plot your routes in BaseCamp on your PC, than on your device. Why? The screen is much bigger, for starters. Using the simple A to B (start point to end point) method and then dragging the magenta to take the roads you want to ride along, all as shown in the video, is pretty easy, surely? You can then insert just about as many shaping points as you like.

As regards your ‘leave the motorway at the next exit’ problem. Yes, if you have placed a point on the opposite carriageway, then the device will do its very best to take you there..... as that is what you have told it to do. You are the master, it is your servant, don’t forget, though it can seem the other way around. Another possible cause, as I explained in the post above, is if the device has its preference set to ‘avoid motorways’. You can still create a route that takes in a motorway, simply by putting a marker (a way or shaping point) onto the motorway. The device will route you there but then take you off the motorway at the next best opportunity..... as that is what you have told it to do. By plotting routes on your PC, with its much larger screen and by careful use of your preference settings, you will be able to spot glitches much quicker and avoid them, too. I cannot emphasise the importance of preference settings and placing points on the right part of the road too much. It’s the two key fundamentals.

You should now have a good idea of why it’s important to know the difference between a waypoint and a shaping point and be able to use each accordingly. You should also be able to create A to B routes on your PC (if the bloke in the video can do it, anyone can) and drag the line to where you want to go, with precise accuracy. Your servant device will now follow your instructions completely. Yes, it might throw you the odd rare wobbly but once you get used to it, you’ll be able to sort these out on the fly, trust me on that.


Now time for another two tips.

1. If you start to use your PC to create your routes, you can start to avoid what I call ‘Garmin features’. Most people (including me) have their device and most basic calculation mode set to ‘fastest time’. This works pretty well as the software knows the speed limits for most of the roads on the map. The glitch (it’s just a product of basic maths) is when you sometimes encounter a small street that cuts a corner. The cut thro’ is shorter and at the same speed limit as the main road, therefore it will (according to basic sums) be quicker. But, as we all know, a cut the corner down a narrow street, very often is not quicker in a town. Similarly, a cut the corner out in the countryside might sometimes take you down 200 yards of small track, just to save 300 yards of good quality tarmac. Using your PC and by zooming in, you can very often spot these ‘features’ and drag the magenta line to avoid them. Yes, it takes time and yes, you can avoid them by using common sense when out riding but, at least to me, spending a few minutes sorting them out in the comfort of your home makes sense, surely?

Another time basic maths can throw up a glitch is when the route offered up, takes you through a town when (by looking at the map) it might well be quickest to take the longer ring road. Or, alternatively, taking some different roads to miss the town and its ring road completely, might make better sense. This is just the application of common sense and your imagination, no different to using a paper map and highlighter. Treat your moveable magenta line as your highlighter on a conventional map. Above all, use your imagination. Garmin, as it has responded to bikermates’ requests to provide a device to: “Take me from A to B, avoiding motorways (I feckin’ hate them) and take me twisting’. They have stripped a lot of the imagination out of it; put some back in!

When you get good at creating your own routes (it will suddenly click, trust me) you will get good at seeing bits when you’ll say to yourself, “If I go down that magenta line, I’ll end up doing a left, right, left in the town, crossing roads and I’ll have to give way a lot. If I just go here and here, it will be a bit further but easier. Let’s see...”. Then move the route. It might snap to something good.... or crazy. If so, use the undo button and try something else. Still crazy? Undo again.... and give up, sometimes Garmin really does know best. It all comes with experience. Like most things, the more you do it, the easier it becomes.


2. Once you have carefully created your route(s) on your PC and sent it to your device.... fire up your device, import them all and check them. Does the route on the device:

A. Take the same shape as that on your PC? You should be able to see the little blue dots (shaping points) and flags for any ‘must do’ waypoints? Yes, great.

B. Have just about the same mileage? Some variation is not uncommon, you’ll get used to seeing that. Use your common sense. Yes, great.

If the answer to either is a significant ‘No’ you now have the chance to sort it out from the comfort of your home. If you chose not to check, then that is up to you; you are the master, after all.




PS As to the
Also, by the time you spent doing all of this, you could of riden it? again, Id assumed it would be a bit easier, but obviously not...
Was what the bloke in the video demonstrated actually that difficult or time consuming? He did it slowly to demonstrate, I am sure he rattles along on his own.

Yup, you can just go out and ride, there is nothing to stop you at all. You are in charge of your life, not us or Garmin. Sell your device and turn off your PC, it’s that easy. Enjoy your days on the NC 500, you’ll probably not even need a map.
 
Thanks Wapping for your post. Most interesting and very valid I'm sure.
If I find a bit of time over the weekend I will have another play... I afraid that's my problem.. no time to spend messing with it, and when I do have time, looking at a screen is the last thing I want to do :)

I did have a quick mess about the other night and I had the flag start / end points, but not the shaping point tab? so I may have the wrong base camp downloaded.
Anyway, Richard (from the other thread) has offered to take a look so I will tie up with him at some point. I'm sure he'll show me a lot thats obviouse to the people who's been doing it a while, but not for the novice.

Again, many thanks for all your help on this ... I do ride bikes to relax and get away from all this stuff, but times move on and the Nav 5 on the bike is a very useful bit of kit.. I'm determined to master it!! :)
 
.....I had the flag start / end points, but not the shaping point tab? so I may have the wrong base camp downloaded.

.....I'm determined to master it!

I am not sure how you can have the ‘wrong BaseCamp’ loaded.

I am sure you are..... and will.
 
I am not sure how you can have the ‘wrong BaseCamp’ loaded.

I am sure you are..... and will.

Have found the shaping point (WAS NOT ON THE TOOL BAR FOR SOME REASON)... playing :)
 
Seek and ye shall find, indeed.

Report back on how you get on, please.

If your PC is the same as a Mac, I think you should be able to drag / select various tabs onto the tool bar. Though quite why the shaping point one isn’t there by default is a mystery.
 
I’ve learned almost all the lessons above the hard way over several years of using Basecamp and SatNav travel and continue to stick a Garmin on the screen of my GPS equipped 4 wheel chariot as well as a current NAV6 on the bike.

Have also integrated as many tips as possible from Mr. W as above over the years. Especially the keys points around Waypoints and Shaping Points.

The only minor tip I might add is that I index my Routes for a trip in a simple Alpha-Numeric way that makes them appear in running order, e.g. D01 to X town, D02 to AnyTown. Why? ‘cos like all computer indexing, for things to appear in order you have to use reverse date styles (2020-0319) or D01, D02 so it appears before D10, etc.

On a trip I save the daily track for downloading when I get home and see where I actually went compared with what I planned to do. Diversions do happen for many reasons. I usually delete the planned Route at the end of the day to remove clutter a free up memory space.

Planning is all part of the fun for me.
 
I too list my routes with a prefix 01, 02, 03....10, 11, 12... one for each day. If I have two alternatives on one day or split a route into morning and afternoon, I prefix them 03.1 and 03.2 for example. I think it’s a hangover from a time before Garmin put the calendar function in. It also helps me tell bods in the bunch following me: “Today it is route 7”, usually followed by a plaintive, “I don’t have route 7, mate. I have 6 and 8”..... and so the day starts. All good fun, really.

I also save the tracks to compare them with the routes and am sad enough to also make notes in my little black book. A book that has come to my rescue on several occasions, too.
 
Beaver, as Lee said, I cut out your BaseCamp challenge, taking it from the Nav V section and putting it into the BaseCamp section.

Richard
 
Trip planner went cracy

I created a trip in Basecamp to go from a starting point NW of Madrid to an end point on the other side of the city. The calculated route took me through the city centre which I wanted to avoid so I dropped a couple of shaping points (not way points) along a subterranean motorway tunnel bypass at the south of the city, a faster route.

The route looked good on Basecamp and my Navigator 5. Off I went. I lost GPS connection in the tunnels but once out it locked onto GPS again and navigated correctly. I was 1 Km away from the end point when I missed a turn. The route recalculated but that's that's when the sh!t hit the fan. The recalculated route was complete nonsense.

It directed me away in the opposite direction from my destination, I was only 1 Km away but the satnav showed another 16 Km left. I still have no idea where it was sending me to.

I cancelled the trip, selected the end point from the "Where to" menu and it got me there ok. So the Navigator 5 is ok, it was the Trip Planner's route recalculation that got its knickers in a twist.

Any ideas? This has neer happened before!
 


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