Nav VI Weirdness

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mediamark

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Hi folks,

Having switched from a Nav5 to a Nav6, I've encountered frustrating issues on two recent rides.

Having created routes in Basecamp, using Faster Time & shaping points rather than waypoint, the routes have been transferred to my Nav6 then shared to a mate's Nav6 via Bluetooth. We've checked the settings/tick boxes on our Navs are identical.

During the rides, usually later into the route, our Navs start to differ in the direction the route should go.
My mates Nav appears to stick to the route as plotted, yet mine seems to want to deviate, taking the fastest, most direct route.

Any helpful suggestions would be greatly received.

Cheers
 
When (other than ‘later in the day’) does this recalculation of the route on your device occur?

Do you wander off the preplanned route and have auto-recalculation turned on?
 
Auto recalculate is on but we haven't deviated from the plotted route at the point it occurs.

My Nav doesn't indicate it's recalculating, just wants to take me on a different route to the route on my mate's Nav.

Sent from my SM-G986B using Tapatalk
 
As your friend's route does not alter, logically the problem exists on your device only.

You may not notice an automatic recalculation taking place, nor necessarily what prompts it. Does you friend have auto-recalcultion turned on, too?

What happens if you turn auto-recaluation off or set it to prompted, and you select 'no' when asked?

Does it happen every time you run and ride the route and in the same place?

Does it happen each and every time you ride together on every route? Every other route? One in five? One in ten?

Are the maps the same in each device?

When you first both load the routes up, do the routes look the same ie. the same shape and the same distance?

Are you sure the preference settings are the same in both devices?

What happens if you add some more shaping points nearer to the end of routes?
 
If you are relying on shaping points then you MUST turn off auto-recalculate, otherwise when it recalculates, it strips out all shaping points and only uses Waypoints. It tries to navigate you between the Waypoints using your devices settings.
 
If you are relying on shaping points then you MUST turn off auto-recalculate, otherwise when it recalculates, it strips out all shaping points and only uses Waypoints. It tries to navigate you between the Waypoints using your devices settings.

Thats a good tip, thanks

As the OP mentioned has sharing routes via Bluetooth, I feel this is related so Im not really hijacking the thread .... can anyone think of a reason why my Nav V has stopped 'seeing' my pals's Nav VI. Both are set to 'find me' and they used to see each other without a problem
 
If you are relying on shaping points then you MUST turn off auto-recalculate, otherwise when it recalculates, it strips out all shaping points and only uses Waypoints. It tries to navigate you between the Waypoints using your devices settings.

That’s my guess, too. I am guessing that his friend doesn’t have autorecalculate turned on, hence his route didn’t alter at all. Problems like these are very often down to settings and choices, such as “Should I have autorecalculate on or off?”. The answer is always, turn it off! Or at least it should be.
 
Thanks for your replies guys, I thought you'd cracked it but my mate's just confirmed that his is also set to Auto-recalculate.

I'd assumed that Auto-recalculate was only triggered if you deviated from the planned route, which we haven't.
If it's a plotted route, why would it auto-recalculate at all? Waypoints or shaping points??

It's weird though that on my previous devices; a Zumo 660 & Nav V, I've always left Auto-recalculate on and never had an issue with shaping points, as I rarely use waypoints, other than the starting & endpoints.

Regards
 
That’s my guess, too. I am guessing that his friend doesn’t have autorecalculate turned on, hence his route didn’t alter at all. Problems like these are very often down to settings and choices, such as “Should I have autorecalculate on or off?”. The answer is always, turn it off! Or at least it should be.

I agree with this ,defo turn off the auto re calc. If you get diverted or take a turn to early, just zoom out on the nav and head back towards the magenta line
 
by any chance did you start your pre defined route from different points,or have either of you done these routes before using the very same pre defined route or a very similar route.
 
We both started from the same point of origin. These were both new routes, not plotted or ridden before, created in Basecamp

Sent from my SM-G986B using Tapatalk
 
If you created the route, imported it into your device, then shared it with your friend and you are certain that no recalculation took place whilst you rode the magenta line..... did you compare the route displayed on your device, with that displayed on your friend’s device, before you set off?

I only ask as, if no recalculation took place as you rode along, your route must have differed from your friend’s right from the very start.

You haven’t told us if it was just the once this anomaly happened and / or if it happens regularly on different routes? When it does, is it always your machine that rewrites the route being ridden, whilst your friend’s version (which he receives from you) stays solid and true?
 
We didn't check the routes, side by side, before we set off but will do next time.

I swapped to the Nav 6 just before the lockdown so it hasn't had much use until the two recent rides.

It appears to me that my mate's Nav is sticking to the route as plotted.

It's as if mine switches to take the fastest, most direct route to the final waypoint.

Sent from my SM-G986B using Tapatalk
 
It's as if mine switches to take the fastest, most direct route to the final waypoint.

Sent from my SM-G986B using Tapatalk[/QUOTE]

Thats where i would begin to compare the routes side by side, as Wapping says, also check that you are using the same maps, you could also check that the routes are the same length when transfered.
 
I am with leedude03 on this one, we maybe lack enough detail to help you. But, here goes:

I am going to have a guess as to what is happening. Forgive me if I am wrong but I am struggling to understand exactly what is going on. First let's see if I have understood how you created the route. As I understand it, your route goes:

A, START POINT

B, shaping point

C, shaping point

D, shaping point

E, shaping point

F, shaping point

G, shaping point

H, END POINT

If I read your opening post correctly, your Nav VI follows the route correctly A, to B, to C, to D. After shaping point D, your device then alters the route by taking you directly (via the fastest route) straight to H, ie it misses out shaping points E, F and G. Whilst your friend's Nav VI follows the correct route, via the last three shaping points. Is that correct? If so (and if your device made no recalculation of the route whilst you rode along) that is indeed a strange thing to happen. But I might be able to guess why....

When you fired up the route your Nav VI should have given you two choices, being: Do you want to navigate to A or H, being the start and end points. You will not have been asked if you want to navigate to B, C, D, E, F and G as they are only shaping points. Is that guess correct? If so, let's guess a bit more....

1. That you were not at point A, when you fired up your device

2. You selected, 'Take me to H', whilst your friend chose 'Take me to A'

3. That between wherever you were, there is only one logical road that the device can take to A and then through B, C, to D, so it will follow the route exactly.

4. At shaping point D, there happened to be a choice of roads the device could take:

i. Through E and F, to G

ii. Straight to G

5. Right back at the start you had asked your device to 'Take me to G', so that is what it is doing, via the fastest route. It just happened that the fastest route happened to be A, to B, to C, to D, then straight to G by missing out E and F

6. Your friend at the start, had selected 'Take me to A' after which his route would run perfectly, A to B, to C, to D, to E, to F, to end at G

I'll confess that the above is one hell of a guess, but it's the best I can do at the moment, to explain why the route your Nav VI followed, differed from your friend's route in his Nav VI.

If I am incorrect, please give us a fuller description of how your route was structured and exactly what you experienced, line by line, versus what your friend experienced. Diagnosing anomalies remotely is pretty hard otherwise.

Thank you.
 
Thanks Wapping, I appreciate your response.

  • "Your Nav VI follows the route correctly A, to B, to C, to D. After shaping point D, your device then alters the route by taking you directly (via the fastest route) straight to H, ie it misses out shaping points E, F and G. Whilst your friend's Nav VI follows the correct route, via the last three shaping points"
This is correct. My device made no (visible) recalculation at the point our Navs began to differ on the route.

  • "When you fired up the route your Nav VI should have given you two choices, being: Do you want to navigate to A or H, being the start and endpoints. You will not have been asked if you want to navigate to B, C, D, E, F and G as they are only shaping points."
That is incorrect. I can see & select all the points in the route.

  • "1. That you were not at point A, when you fired up your device"
We were at point A when we began the route.

  • "2. You selected, 'Take me to H', whilst your friend chose 'Take me to A'
This is where you may be onto something, on the most recent ride, there were two occasions, earlier in the ride, where we had to 'skip waypoints'. At the minute I can't remember why we had to but I've always assumed 'skipping waypoints' also applies to shaping points but im guessing not??

Even though skipping points, at that point, the route continued as expected. We were approx 2/3 into the ride when problems arose.

Having used these Navs for a fews years now, I'm doubting my understanding of route planning!
 
Thanks for the reply.

As you can see points B thro’ G as points that you can select on start up to navigate to, I suspect that they are not unannounced ‘shaping points’ but are in fact announced viapoints, also known sometimes as, waypoints. Had you chosen point B as your destination - and then not done any skipping - I think everything should have been OK.

The skipping of announced viapoints / waypoints does (by its very nature) bring about a recalculation, which you cannot avoid. That the skipping process apparently took place late on in the route, may well start to explain why you (and not your friend) were rerouted to the end point. I think your friend did nothing more than skip differently and / or had the points as shaping points, where missing one or more out would have made no difference at all. There are entire threads on how skipping points works, as it’s a bit of a dark art, if you want to make it one.

The way the Nav VI works is very different to earlier BMW navigator devices. Its release also coincided with Garmin’s drive to pander towards people who do not want to create their own routes at all. My suggestion would be:

1. Keep on creating your own routes, preferably using BaseCamp.

2. Use announced shaping points to shape the route, rather than announced viapoints or waypoints.

3. Turn auto-recalculation to off or at least prompted. That way you retain control of the device, not the other way around.

4. Get used to how the skip button works. It confused the hell out of me at first.

I never used to use any mid-route points, other than shaping points. With better knowledge of how the powerful (but sometimes very dumb) Nav VI works and with a better understanding of how powerful BaseCamp can be, I now find I use intermediate announced points more.

One very good trick I learnt off this forum is how to start routes. I now use it quite often. It goes as follows:

Start point, A

Place an announced viapoint (not a shaping point) at say somewhere between a quarter and five miles from your start point, on a road you know you want to use.

Complete the rest of the route with shaping points only, unless that is there is some other point(s) you MUST pass through between the start and end points.

When firing up the route you will then be presented with just three choices of where to navigate to.

1. Your start point

2. The announced viapoint, that you placed a quarter or five miles away (use your common sense on where to place this)

3. The end point

Chose 2 and the route will run perfectly, all the way to the end. Made easier again if you have no announced via or waypoints between point 2 and the end, meaning you’ll have nothing to skip later in the day.

I hope the above is helpful. By all means come back if I have misunderstood something or if anything is unclear.

Richard
 
if you were at point A when you started the route what did the nav ask you to select? . because if it asked you to select point A you were not at the start (point A), and if you selected anything other than point A this may be why the problem occured. also if you chose to skip waypoints and go directly to the end point this may have caused your issue. The issue with the nav sticking to the route untill 2/3 distance after skipping points would likely be because your route up to the next point would be the quickest route as dictated by the nav settings.
 
Thanks again, for your responses.

This is making more sense now but as bits of the most recent ride come back to me I'm still curious about why, if the Start & Endpoints were the only waypoints (Flags) inserted into the route, did some of the shaping points, inserted using the pen in Basecamp, appear as orange flags along the route on my Nav but not on my mates? Are these converted to Viapoints?

I commented on this at the time to my mate via comms, as the blue bar across the top of the screen turned Orange on my Nav, yet didn't on his.

Additionally, he commented that as we approached the destination waypoint, he could see dozens of flags on his Nav yet mine showed just one??

Having re-watched the video tutorials in the Basecamp section, I'm thinking that what I'm doing is in line with his explanation.

Regards
 
Why the shaping points (blue dots) appeared as orange (announced viapoints) I have no idea. Though, when I read your words about using a pen, I guess you were creating the route directly in the Nav VI, when I thought your opening post said it was created in BaseCamp? Why they are blue dots on your friend’s device, I have no idea either.

I don’t create many routes directly within the device, but can easily assume that points dropped via a pen will, by default, created as announced viapoints (orange flags) and not simple blue dot shaping points. If this is indeed the case, then you can convert orange flags to blue dots (and visa-versa) from within the Nav VI itself.

The more I read of this thread, the more it points to operator error, rather than a specific Garmin glitch. That is nothing to be ashamed about at all, it is a tricky device to work, straight out of the box, as I know only too well.
 
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