What's all this in my clutch? And is it worn out?

ThreeDawg

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Had the starter motor off my 1100 to check how much crap was in there and to fit a new sidestand switch (the wire runs behind the starter) and noticed quite a lot of gungy oil around and below the clutch. Is this just normal, or might I have a problem? There doesn't seem to be any oil actually on the clutch itself.

I then compounded my misery by measuring between the two pressure plates figuring that this would indicate the absolute minimum the clutch plate could be - I assume that the pressure plates wear a bit and may have a lip at the edge. Is this bollocks? I hope so, because I reckon it's about 4.3mm.

I hope to be taking it back to Africa (Covid permitting) in November, so I'm starting to gather odds and sods for the trip and going through to catch any problems that may be starting on the old thing. The clutch does not slip, but do I replace it or leave a known quantity well alone. I don't want to be regretting my decision up to my axles in sand in northern Damaraland.:eek: It's done about 70,000.

Some pics:

I did wipe some of the oil off, but there's still plenty in there.

51298774248_ce06a536e2_b.jpg


Legit?

51299307369_27d9bafcf0_b.jpg
[/url]

No crap, at least on the bits I can see

51298598051_bde3706585_b.jpg
 
Steptoe or Mikeyboy are the best persons to ask.


Given that you say 70,000 one one clutch plate , it might be a good idea to change it ,

oil i would say is clutch slave cylinder leaking, byt as i said, Steptoe & Mikeyboy
 
You got two shaft seals in there. Engine crank shaft oil seal and the gearbox input shaft oil seal.

I could say smell the oil to determine engine or gearbox, but it doesn’t really matter. You will have to split the bike to change either.

The question is, how bad is it leaking, bearing in mind that a little oil will go a long way. I’ve had a crankshaft oil seal leaking so that it was dripping oil off the bash plate. But no contamination to the clutch.
The leak didn’t stop me putting 2k on the bike. Changing the seal when I got home.

But you’re aware of a problem, and it will always be on your mind until you get it fixed….:)
 
ThreeDawg said:
Had the starter motor off my 1100 to check how much crap was in there and to fit a new sidestand switch (the wire runs behind the starter) and noticed quite a lot of gungy oil around and below the clutch. Is this just normal, or might I have a problem? There doesn't seem to be any oil actually on the clutch itself.

I then compounded my misery by measuring between the two pressure plates figuring that this would indicate the absolute minimum the clutch plate could be - I assume that the pressure plates wear a bit and may have a lip at the edge. Is this bollocks? I hope so, because I reckon it's about 4.3mm.

I hope to be taking it back to Africa (Covid permitting) in November, so I'm starting to gather odds and sods for the trip and going through to catch any problems that may be starting on the old thing. The clutch does not slip, but do I replace it or leave a known quantity well alone. I don't want to be regretting my decision up to my axles in sand in northern Damaraland.:eek: It's done about 70,000.

Some pics:

I did wipe some of the oil off, but there's still plenty in there.

51298774248_ce06a536e2_b.jpg


Legit?

51299307369_27d9bafcf0_b.jpg
[/url]

No crap, at least on the bits I can see

51298598051_bde3706585_b.jpg
Click to expand...

Could be that youve lost the timing inspection plug on the right hand side and thats just an accumulation of water n clutch dust after the last wash or left in the rain :nenau
 
Could it also potentially be trickling down from the air box above?

The crankcase breather exists to the air box and there’s a drain on one side and, like Ian said, a little warm oil goes a long way and could easily end up pooling where you’ve found a teaspoon of it thats take 70k miles to build up

Ian J Hartley said:
You got two shaft seals in there. Engine crank shaft oil seal and the gearbox input shaft oil seal.

I could say smell the oil to determine engine or gearbox, but it doesn’t really matter. You will have to split the bike to change either.

The question is, how bad is it leaking, bearing in mind that a little oil will go a long way. I’ve had a crankshaft oil seal leaking so that it was dripping oil off the bash plate. But no contamination to the clutch.
The leak didn’t stop me putting 2k on the bike. Changing the seal when I got home.

But you’re aware of a problem, and it will always be on your mind until you get it fixed….:)
Click to expand...
 
Thanks for the input. I guess the only way is to tear it down and see what's what. Mrs 3D would not want a mechanical to interrupt her adventure.
 
Another question: I normally go OEM for everything on my bike, which has worked well for me so far, but for an extra 70 quids or so I could go for an oil resistant (so-called heavy duty) clutch plate. Are these any good? Fit and forget works well in my world.
 
ThreeDawg said:
Another question: I normally go OEM for everything on my bike, which has worked well for me so far, but for an extra 70 quids or so I could go for an oil resistant (so-called heavy duty) clutch plate. Are these any good? Fit and forget works well in my world.
Click to expand...

Original,I guess has lasted 70 k,
Not much wrong with that.
It’s only the oil that has raised your attention to things.
Fix the leak and fit oem spec
 
Yeah, can't complain - I'm the second owner and I got the bike at 18K, so deffo on the original clutch. Will only do this job once though, and want to get the best - I expect to take this bike off on many more adventures before I'm too decrepit to swing a leg over it.:banana
 
ThreeDawg said:
Yeah, can't complain - I'm the second owner and I got the bike at 18K, so deffo on the original clutch. Will only do this job once though, and want to get the best - I expect to take this bike off on many more adventures before I'm too decrepit to swing a leg over it.:banana
Click to expand...

I’ve no personal experience,
But,have heard reports that the oil proof clutches can be juddery and grabby.
Someone with real world experience may shout up.
But if the leak is fixed the upgrade clutch is unnecessary.
The rear engine seals are not the easiest thing to fit so make sure your happy before building it all up
 
ThreeDawg said:
Hum, will see about the seal. Is there a special tool or does it simply require a skilled hand?
Click to expand...

I too would miss out the Oil Proof Clutch to be honest, I had to pull a few back out, even though folks insisted it was what they wanted, even when I'd said they were not really for road use, they tend to need a heavier pull !

The seals are a dry teflon membrane type seal, they need heated up a bit to make them pliable (rub them around in your hands for 20 seconds or so,)
the inner diameter goes inwards (Towards the front of the engine) I have had a couple of folks that complained of oil leaks and the membrane was badly aligned

A very small diameter but definitely not sharp screwdriver can assist in rolling in the membrane into place when you are inserting the outer diameter

Oh and your Clutch release arm on the gearbox upgrade to a stainless one and make sure the cable and the pivot are nice and free :thumb

Do not use the crank seals that motorworks sell They have an outer felt layer that prevents you from making sure that you have correctly fitted the membrane to the crank!
 
DrFarkoff said:
I too would miss out the Oil Proof Clutch to be honest, I had to pull a few back out, even though folks insisted it was what they wanted, even when I'd said they were not really for road use, they tend to need a heavier pull !

The seals are a dry teflon membrane type seal, they need heated up a bit to make them pliable (rub them around in your hands for 20 seconds or so,)
the inner diameter goes inwards (Towards the front of the engine) I have had a couple of folks that complained of oil leaks and the membrane was badly aligned

A very small diameter but definitely not sharp screwdriver can assist in rolling in the membrane into place when you are inserting the outer diameter

Oh and your Clutch release arm on the gearbox upgrade to a stainless one and make sure the cable and the pivot are nice and free :thumb

Do not use the crank seals that motorworks sell They have an outer felt layer that prevents you from making sure that you have correctly fitted the membrane to the crank!
Click to expand...
Hmm interesting to know that..so what seal do you use and where do you get it from ? My 1100 is due to be stripped down for a gearbox change and probably a new clutch fitted and was mentioned new seals too ..
 
West coast gser said:
Hmm interesting to know that..so what seal do you use and where do you get it from ? My 1100 is due to be stripped down for a gearbox change and probably a new clutch fitted and was mentioned new seals too ..
Click to expand...

Just use the OE BM ones They are not cheap but you they are a patented size and with the OE ones you can see how they have fitted with the ones that M'Works have sourced you cannot as they have a thick felt washer that obscures your view for visual verification

Also with yours do a starter service and think about the stainless clutch arm the alloy ones are getting few and far between and prone to break
 
DrFarkoff said:
Just use the OE BM ones They are not cheap but you they are a patented size and with the OE ones you can see how they have fitted with the ones that M'Works have sourced you cannot as they have a thick felt washer that obscures your view for visual verification

Also with yours do a starter service and think about the stainless clutch arm the alloy ones are getting few and far between and prone to break
Click to expand...

Cheers ...oh the starter got cleaned and rebuilt couple o yrs ago ..the magnets gad come off n jammed ..took it to a guy who fixes electric motors alternators starter motors n he stripped it down when I was there n showed me the workings he said they're good starter motors he had a rummage n found a starter of a Peugeot but he said the magnets are reversed showed me ..left it with him to clean/grease n rebuild ..works perfectly..also bought a new one off eBay n have another spare from a pile of gs bits I got..
 
West coast gser said:
Cheers ...oh the starter got cleaned and rebuilt couple o yrs ago ..the magnets gad come off n jammed ..took it to a guy who fixes electric motors alternators starter motors n he stripped it down when I was there n showed me the workings he said they're good starter motors he had a rummage n found a starter of a Peugeot but he said the magnets are reversed showed me ..left it with him to clean/grease n rebuild ..works perfectly..also bought a new one off eBay n have another spare from a pile of gs bits I got..
Click to expand...

You would be surprised how much crud and how much the grease has dried up in a couple of years

Its a freebie and easy to do Also dab some silicone around the reduction gearbox cover to help stick it in place in case it decides to let go and clang onto the armature
 
ThreeDawg said:
Another question: I normally go OEM for everything on my bike, which has worked well for me so far, but for an extra 70 quids or so I could go for an oil resistant (so-called heavy duty) clutch plate. Are these any good? Fit and forget works well in my world.
Click to expand...

What’s ‘fit and forget’ about it ? It maybe oil resistant, but it doesn’t fix oil leaks. Which are more of a concern than not having to replace a clutch.
 
OK, so I've got the bike ready to pull the trans, just waiting for a mate to help lift it.

At the risk of getting flamed (I have read a few threads on advrider about this without finding much useful info) I have here Honda M77 assembly paste and Liqui Moly LM 47 grease to lubricate the bits that need lubricating. I'm leaning towards the Honda stuff as it seems to have a higher temperature range than the Liqui Moly.
 
Nippy Normans supply Touratech, Wunderlich, Desert Fox and many other makes of accessories.
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