First time flat battery

RallyeGS said:
I have the BMW alarm and tracker on my bike.
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I have no alarm on my 1250 but just the tracker! Never wanted it in the first place. Subscription expired at the 12 month point. Original battery failed at the 14 month point and was replaced by me dealer with a Yuasa. That was as flat as a pancake this morning. Took the bike apart and found the tracker to remove it. It is rated as 12v 2 amp.
Battery now being sorted and hopefully will have no more problems.
 
Scorpion have informed me that when “asleep”, the tracker consumes 0.4mA, though they also said “less than a milliamp”, which is not quite so precise.

They were not able to confirm the “awake” current, nor the current when transmitting, nor the minimum duration of any awake periods, so it is difficult to estimate the consumption, but if you assume your bike is un disturbed in your garage, and the tracker is asleep, 1mA would take 1000 hours to run your battery down by 1Ah, which is less than 10% of the battery capacity, and probably a good indicator of an acceptable discharge.

If your battery is fully charged at the start, of course.

1000 hours is just shy of 6 weeks, and makes some sense given the advice to charge the bike if not used for 4 weeks. A bit of a margin.


If your battery’s duff, not fully charged, or your tracker isn’t asleep, you’ll have issues sooner than this.
 
SBD said:
Scorpion have informed me that when “asleep”, the tracker consumes 0.4mA, though they also said “less than a milliamp”, which is not quite so precise.

They were not able to confirm the “awake” current, nor the current when transmitting, nor the minimum duration of any awake periods, so it is difficult to estimate the consumption, but if you assume your bike is un disturbed in your garage, and the tracker is asleep, 1mA would take 1000 hours to run your battery down by 1Ah, which is less than 10% of the battery capacity, and probably a good indicator of an acceptable discharge.

If your battery is fully charged at the start, of course.

1000 hours is just shy of 6 weeks, and makes some sense given the advice to charge the bike if not used for 4 weeks. A bit of a margin.


If your battery’s duff, not fully charged, or your tracker isn’t asleep, you’ll have issues sooner than this.
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I have no experience with a tracker, but I know a little bit about computers in general.

The current used while a unit is in sleep mode may well be less than 1mA. However, a computer in sleepmode means that the processor does not do much beyond allowing the clock to tick. Anytime it needs to do some chores, like monitoring certain parameters, the processor has to pop out of the sleepmode. This "out of sleep" condition may be anything form once a second to whatevere, and defines how long it takes for the tracker to respond to an "undesired condition" and fire up the tracking.

So, while the math for the sleeptime may be correct as such, it only paints half the picture. And the general experience from users appears to indicate that the tracker does indeed run the battery down way quicker than the suggested by the math.
 
knutk said:
I have no experience with a tracker, but I know a little bit about computers in general.

The current used while a unit is in sleep mode may well be less than 1mA. However, a computer in sleepmode means that the processor does not do much beyond allowing the clock to tick. Anytime it needs to do some chores, like monitoring certain parameters, the processor has to pop out of the sleepmode. This "out of sleep" condition may be anything form once a second to whatevere, and defines how long it takes for the tracker to respond to an "undesired condition" and fire up the tracking.

So, while the math for the sleeptime may be correct as such, it only paints half the picture. And the general experience from users appears to indicate that the tracker does indeed run the battery down way quicker than the suggested by the math.
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A very good explanation - in order to estimate the battery life we need to know the average 'on time' of the tracker and the 'on current'.

The Datatool trackers have an in-built 250mAH battery, it is supposed to isolate the bike battery from any current drain, however once that battery goes flat then it will need to take current from the bike battery.
 
Engineer said:
A very good explanation - in order to estimate the battery life we need to know the average 'on time' of the tracker and the 'on current'.

The Datatool trackers have an in-built 250mAH battery, it is supposed to isolate the bike battery from any current drain, however once that battery goes flat then it will need to take current from the bike battery.
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maybe time for lithium battery, good point it goes low, can warm up and ride away, lithium only lose 10% in year even bike not started, so can have no worry in garage, maybe drop a little more with tracker, but you can still start bike, AGM not possible if no jump starter, or battery tender
 
Winjar said:
maybe time for lithium battery, good point it goes low, can warm up and ride away, lithium only lose 10% in year even bike not started, so can have no worry in garage, maybe drop a little more with tracker, but you can still start bike, AGM not possible if no jump starter, or battery tender
Click to expand...

a flat battery is a flat battery whatever the internal chemistry
 
wessie said:
a flat battery is a flat battery whatever the internal chemistry
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lithium can come back after warming from very low, but agree flat is flat, but lithium take many months to become flat, AGM in 3 weeks bike with tracker and no tender will not start
 
Winjar said:
lithium can come back after warming from very low, but agree flat is flat, but lithium take many months to become flat, AGM in 3 weeks bike with tracker and no tender will not start
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I am not convinced. The tracker will drain a lithium battery at the same rate as an AGM battery. A lithium battery will only "come back when warmed up" if it actually has some charge within it. Even a fully charged Lithium battery can appear dead at 0C but will wake up if you turn the lights on for a while. I think you misunderstand what happens to the lithium chemistry when cold.
 
wessie said:
I am not convinced. The tracker will drain a lithium battery at the same rate as an AGM battery. A lithium battery will only "come back when warmed up" if it actually has some charge within it. Even a fully charged Lithium battery can appear dead at 0C but will wake up if you turn the lights on for a while. I think you misunderstand what happens to the lithium chemistry when cold.
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I think you read me wrong, that is what I say, also most good lithium have BMS so not go total flat anymore, they save a little power to wake with lights etc.
 
Engineer said:
.......

The Datatool trackers have an in-built 250mAH battery, it is supposed to isolate the bike battery from any current drain, however once that battery goes flat then it will need to take current from the bike battery.
Click to expand...

Are you sure about this order?

If the tracker runs the internal battery until it's flat, then, let's say the bike has been parked for a week and the tracker is now draining the main battery as the internal battery is run down, simply removing the bikes battery ground connection will disable the tracker?

I would humbly suggest the opposite: The tracker mainly relies on the bikes battery, but if the battery is disconnected, the tracker will continue to run from the internal battery that allows the tracker to work for a while.

However, if the battery is only 250mA, which is not much, then this would imply that the power used by the tracker is quite modest, as one would expect the tracker to work for several days relying on the internal battery only.

Or am I all wrong here?
 
knutk said:
Are you sure about this order?

If the tracker runs the internal battery until it's flat, then, let's say the bike has been parked for a week and the tracker is now draining the main battery as the internal battery is run down, simply removing the bikes battery ground connection will disable the tracker?

I would humbly suggest the opposite: The tracker mainly relies on the bikes battery, but if the battery is disconnected, the tracker will continue to run from the internal battery that allows the tracker to work for a while.

However, if the battery is only 250mA, which is not much, then this would imply that the power used by the tracker is quite modest, as one would expect the tracker to work for several days relying on the internal battery only.

Or am I all wrong here?
Click to expand...

I am not sure either :)

I need to do some current measurements when I get some time.

I'd like to know what the current drain on the battery is when the tracker is disconnected and when it's connected.

What is the current draw from the tracker when it is idle and when it is transmitting?

What is the self discharge rate of the Exide 14AH battery?

The bottom line is - I would expect the battery to hold up for two weeks of the bike not being used.

My Triumph Thruxton R does not drain its battery after two weeks.
 
Engineer said:
I am not sure either :)

I need to do some current measurements when I get some time.

I'd like to know what the current drain on the battery is when the tracker is disconnected and when it's connected.

What is the current draw from the tracker when it is idle and when it is transmitting?

What is the self discharge rate of the Exide 14AH battery?

The bottom line is - I would expect the battery to hold up for two weeks of the bike not being used.

My Triumph Thruxton R does not drain its battery after two weeks.
Click to expand...

I have a self contained Monimoto tracker which sends a message to my phone each day telling me that it's happy.

If my tracker with its small internal battery can monitor, send daily messages via SIM card and and still be going strong after at least 18 months then the BMW tracker sounds to be very heavy on electric consumption compared.
 
SteveC10 said:
I have a self contained Monimoto tracker which sends a message to my phone each day telling me that it's happy.

If my tracker with its small internal battery can monitor, send daily messages via SIM card and and still be going strong after at least 18 months then the BMW tracker sounds to be very heavy on electric consumption compared.
Click to expand...

The only thing I know for sure is that this requires more investigation - to understand what is really going on I need to answers the questions in my previous post.
 
My 1250 hadn’t moved since September until I part exchanged it last weekend an fired up no problem, despite not using my Optimate. My 1200 never needed charging either.

My new-to-me 2020 XR has the Datatool tracker fitted and the dealer fitted a new battery and fitted an Optimate lead before I collected the bike, so I suspect battery drain will be an issue.

Has anyone had their tracker removed? I really don’t want a stolen bike back and have no plans to take out a subscription.
 
sven said:
My 1250 hadn’t moved since September until I part exchanged it last weekend an fired up no problem, despite not using my Optimate. My 1200 never needed charging either.

My new-to-me 2020 XR has the Datatool tracker fitted and the dealer fitted a new battery and fitted an Optimate lead before I collected the bike, so I suspect battery drain will be an issue.

Has anyone had their tracker removed? I really don’t want a stolen bike back and have no plans to take out a subscription.
Click to expand...

When mine was stolen the insurance went from £600 to £1,600 a year. An unrecovered bike is a total loss on your policy for the next 5 years.
 
BMW Roadside Assistance are on their way to me (again) for a flat battery. Rode it 12 days ago and the battery is showing 8.1volts according to the Tracker app. I’m convinced that the combination of tracker and alarm are discharging the battery.
 
RallyeGS said:
BMW Roadside Assistance are on their way to me (again) for a flat battery. Rode it 12 days ago and the battery is showing 8.1volts according to the Tracker app. I’m convinced that the combination of tracker and alarm are discharging the battery.
Click to expand...

I reckon that you can just about get away with a week of on-use before low battery problems start to show up. I really need to get a multi-meter and measure the current draw when the bike is off.
 
Hi guys,

I had my 2021 GSA serviced 3 weeks ago. Since then I haven't ridden it, but have had the electrics on a few times installing a Garmin XT and cradle. Today I switched her on to do a final electrics check and got a low battery warning on the TFT. The bike has let me down once before after being unused for 3-4 weeks, as a result I asked the BMW dealer to check the battery at this latest service which he did, reporting that they had charged the battery and all was well.

I have a Data Tool Tracker installed. I've now attached a charger which has been charging at its maximum of 1 amp for the last 5-6 hours. My previous bike, a K1600 GTL also with a Data Tracker but could be left for at least a couple of months before the battery started to get a little low.

I guess I'll have to take the bike back to the dealer and get them to investigate further. Comments and experiences welcome......
 
BigT said:
Hi guys,

I had my 2021 GSA serviced 3 weeks ago. Since then I haven't ridden it, but have had the electrics on a few times installing a Garmin XT and cradle. Today I switched her on to do a final electrics check and got a low battery warning on the TFT. The bike has let me down once before after being unused for 3-4 weeks, as a result I asked the BMW dealer to check the battery at this latest service which he did, reporting that they had charged the battery and all was well.

I have a Data Tool Tracker installed. I've now attached a charger which has been charging at its maximum of 1 amp for the last 5-6 hours. My previous bike, a K1600 GTL also with a Data Tracker but could be left for at least a couple of months before the battery started to get a little low.

I guess I'll have to take the bike back to the dealer and get them to investigate further. Comments and experiences welcome......
Click to expand...

That's interesting information, maybe the batteries on the 1250GS self discharge more quickly than batteries on the other bikes? or the 1250GS simply consumes more 'standby' current?
 
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