A little bird told me they are partly owned by the insurance companies which might explain why it continues.
Can I reject a bike that has been repaired following an accident?
- Thread starter steadysteve
- Start date
A little bird told me they are partly owned by the insurance companies which might explain why it continues.
Possibly.
I was also told they can be repaired to manufacturers spec if they are bent. I always thought that was taboo and not ‘best practice’ especially on alloy wheels.
I work in the motorcycle industry. I have assessed and repaired many bikes for insurance. These days, they often they get shipped off to "repair centers" which are balls deep in the arseholes of the insurance companies. They get loads of work and they keep the bills smaller for the insurance company.
I've also had assessors come to our workshop to look at bikes that have been crashed and recovered to us.
NEVER EVER EVER have I seen an assessor check a frame. They rarely even understand motorcycles. They're meant to be "engineers" but they rarer have a clue. They look for cracks, breaks and paint damage. They don't check forks are straight, wheels are true etc. NEVER.
You can ask for a second opinion by your main dealer. You should NEVER let your insurance company just take your bike away and deal with it. Because their only interest is their own bottom line. But I guess it's too late for that. Worth a phone call perhaps ?
You have a legal right to chose where your bike is repaired.
I've also had assessors come to our workshop to look at bikes that have been crashed and recovered to us.
NEVER EVER EVER have I seen an assessor check a frame. They rarely even understand motorcycles. They're meant to be "engineers" but they rarer have a clue. They look for cracks, breaks and paint damage. They don't check forks are straight, wheels are true etc. NEVER.
You can ask for a second opinion by your main dealer. You should NEVER let your insurance company just take your bike away and deal with it. Because their only interest is their own bottom line. But I guess it's too late for that. Worth a phone call perhaps ?
You have a legal right to chose where your bike is repaired.
You might be right, however it’s well hidden judging from info on company’s house…
Insurers own a company, whose massively inflated costs are paid for by the insurers? How does that business model work? Can the little bird tweet an explanation, please.
Did you find what was well hidden? What did the search reveal?
Not the insurance companies, I was told it is "allegedly " owned by insurance brokerage firms ie the people you deal with and who recommend you deal with 4D directly and then place the claims /repair process in their hands .
One off my mates was with CN and the other with F J , both basically told deal with 4D or we cannot guarantee when we might be able to send an assessor to your local dealer and there may be a very long delay in processing your claim and authorising repairs if you do not use 4D.
That is why when I was with CN it was written into my Insurance records that I would NOT authorise the use of 4D in the event of a claim or the removal of any of my vehicles to their premises
It seems that a different little bird, tweets a different story.
I cannot see how any insurance company would actively support a company that bumps up claims with horrendous storage fees, over inflated replacement bike hire charges etc etc.
In the case of latter a friend is still stuck in the middle of a legal wrangle for a £8000 plus loan bike hire fee which the offending vehicles insurer is refusing to pay, as is his own insurance company .
His bike an FJR1300 literally had a cracked back mudguard and light cluster that should have taken one day to fix and a maximum of £1000 to fix including the labour ( this was a Yamaha main dealers assesment ) .
Instead 4 D took over 9 weeks as parts were allegedly not available (Yamaha dealer said the parts were in the UK and available for next day delivery).
So the final bill including their £2000 !!!!! Repair was inflated with bike hire over £8000 and storage fees for 9 weeks which ran to over £4000 plus transportation costs from Northumberland to Surrey and back.
Utterly obscene
In the case of latter a friend is still stuck in the middle of a legal wrangle for a £8000 plus loan bike hire fee which the offending vehicles insurer is refusing to pay, as is his own insurance company .
His bike an FJR1300 literally had a cracked back mudguard and light cluster that should have taken one day to fix and a maximum of £1000 to fix including the labour ( this was a Yamaha main dealers assesment ) .
Instead 4 D took over 9 weeks as parts were allegedly not available (Yamaha dealer said the parts were in the UK and available for next day delivery).
So the final bill including their £2000 !!!!! Repair was inflated with bike hire over £8000 and storage fees for 9 weeks which ran to over £4000 plus transportation costs from Northumberland to Surrey and back.
Utterly obscene
So, now we have a company that is owned neither by insurers (as one bird tweeted) or by insurance intermediaries (as another bird tweeted). Everything points to them being a privately owned company but with some sort of loan or bank charge owing to Lloyds bank.
Somehow, the company seems to have built itself into a leading provider of independent (ie non-dealer) repair services. Good work if you can get it, one might imagine. Are they the only repair service in the country? Of course not. Are they the largest? I have no idea, the company website doesn’t claim that they are. Are they the best or worse? I guess nobody here really knows. Those that have had a very good experience, will like them, that’s for certain. Those that did not (though the reasons will doubtless vary) will not. Somewhere in the middle, there must be a whole raft of bods who are just neutral.
Somehow, the company seems to have built itself into a leading provider of independent (ie non-dealer) repair services. Good work if you can get it, one might imagine. Are they the only repair service in the country? Of course not. Are they the largest? I have no idea, the company website doesn’t claim that they are. Are they the best or worse? I guess nobody here really knows. Those that have had a very good experience, will like them, that’s for certain. Those that did not (though the reasons will doubtless vary) will not. Somewhere in the middle, there must be a whole raft of bods who are just neutral.
I have made no reference to any storage costs etc. Storage costs were not mentioned. Up to now ,my dealings with 4D have been the usual calls and emails you might expect to arrange the collection of the bike and most recently to discuss the damage and lastly to be informed they’re going to repair it.
It does seem counter intuitive that they bump up the costs which are ultimately paid by themselves. Perhaps they only play silly buggers and charge storage fees to those insurers who aren’t co-owners. Any delay or disagreement on the repair estimate will add to the overall bill.
I’m not sure what the score is regarding insurance company assessors— for example, when I spoke to my dealer about the incident it seemed like they do any estimate for repairs in-house and then wait to get the authorisation to repair it, or not as the case may be.
Neil, my apologies if I’ve muddied the waters.
Quite how the fellow managed to get himself into a wrangle with seemingly two insurers (his own and the third party’s) over loan bike fees, is not at all clear. Was it something he did off his own bat, because he was so much cleverer than the insurer? Or was it something that perhaps his mate told him to do, as he had a mate that said….
There will undoubtedly be a lot of neutral/ happy punters, very few of which will take to the internet or shout from the rooftops expressing their joy. The unhappy ones will quite likely shout about it giving a distorted view to any observers although the 60% figure for negative reviews suggests it’s more than the minority who are unhappy.
I hadn’t looked at the reviews but, now that I have, it seems that TrustPilot (I guess that’s the source you refer to) have two separate entries for what seems to be the one company.
One shows a satisfaction / dissatisfaction rating of 31-61
The other shows 67-39
In other words, the two polls seem to contradict each other.
One shows a satisfaction / dissatisfaction rating of 31-61
The other shows 67-39
In other words, the two polls seem to contradict each other.
I can see some sense in companies availing themselves of the services of one single central insurance assessor / repair function rather than dealing with umpteen one or two man bands hither and thither across the UK. Logically, it would reduce operating costs (not increase them) and, I guess, bring a level of consistent reporting, rather than relying on Fred to post his estimate, written on the back of a disc brake package.
I see that 4D offer all sorts of other services, including claims analysis. I guess this is useful data for insurers to have? Or it might just be bollox?
I see that 4D offer all sorts of other services, including claims analysis. I guess this is useful data for insurers to have? Or it might just be bollox?
Mistrust runs deep in the bikermate world. They don’t trust rip-off stealers and they don’t trust independents. They only trust what their mate (or UKGSer) tells them.
If it’s any consolation, my employer contracts our business travel arrangements to a third party ‘provider’ (as I believe they are called). It’s a different job but not entirely dissimilar as a business model.
My experience is that they are sometimes very good and at other times garbage, not least when it comes to finding hotels.
My experience is that they are sometimes very good and at other times garbage, not least when it comes to finding hotels.
Internet is awash with complaints with them using 2nd hand parts.
No evidence of ins co involvement found is what I meant
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